Zerg Strategy Discussion

Let me share some of my ZvZ experience and if anyone can confirm this (this is last patch experience with ther roach nerf).

I tried Roach+Muta against Pure Hydra and lost big time.
I tried Roach+Hydra against Hydra and lost.

I tried Zergling+Muta and won barely (but I think this was more because of better Macro as I had more resources invested in each fight).

So basically, Hydra owns all in my experience. Early mass speedling rush can probably kill the Zerg player before he gets a critical mass of Hydra going, but I have no other clue how to stop pure hydra armies.

I haven't tried baneling +hydra against hydra. Usually I need the gas for my hydras. Banelings cost more then roaches to be effective.

 

Overseers still give you supply.

I agree that they should be the unit that gives detection. It was pointless to use any invis units in BW because they had Overlords everywhere. I usually keep one near my enemies base, dropping Changlings in the back, which is not where their army usually is, so you can see plenty of stuff before it dies, and if you put it behind a building only the most perspective players will notice it.

I keep another one near my ramp/choke, and another in my army, and use Changlings whenever I go past a possible expansion to see what kind of forces he has there, instead of wasting an actual unit.

As for ZvZ I like to go Muta/Blings. Muta forces them to get Hydras, and Blings tear up balled up Hydras, plus are excellent for expansion denial/worker harass. Bling drops right into the mineral line are amazing, and if you can take out either the Hatch or Extractors, it was well worth the any losses you accrued.

 

noob question

hey this is kind of a noob question but when they say like 10/9/10 what does that mean exactly?

 

That is the number of drones you need to have before building pools/hatcheries/overlords

 

noob question

but with 10/9/10 strat, what do u build an overlord at 10? or a hatchery at 10? and why does it go back to 9, i'm confused with this paticular strat

 

Drones "disappear" when they turn into a structure - they stop taking up supply. 10/9/10 involves a Drone turning into something, that's for sure

 

i go 10/ overlord/ pool/ 3 more drones to bring to 12 drones/ queen/ 3 zergling eggs/ overlord/ 2 gas/ speedlings / lair/ hydralisk den/ gg.

Im always ahead of other zerg players in 1v1

 

The 10/9/10 was the very first strategy I ever came up with in the Beta... which was:
Make a Spawning Pool at 10.
Make an Overlord at 9.
Make Queen at 10.
Expand.
It doesn't work well any more. Lol. You get no lings, just a fast expansion. I don't use this strategy anymore.


To date, I use this strategy below... it's just an altered 10/9 build.
Make a Spawning Pool at 10.
Make an Overlord at 9.
Make Drones until 11.
Make 3 Zergling Spawning Eggs. (6 Lings when they hatch)
And then at 14, make your Queen. Get gas first, begin tech and then expand.

For the 10/9 build, really TRY and do as much damage as you can to the enemy economy with your Lings. Lings cannot kill much else except for a smaller force.

So really, it's like a 10Pool, 9Lord, 14Queen build. And this build really does work great.
Once you get your Queen, make your first Extractor. Spawn Larva ability. Make an Overlord when you need it. Usually at 16 or 17 Supply.

Lol, I guess I called it 10/9/10 because a couple months ago, I was pretty noob at SC2 then.

 

@BreadBucket

Yea, your strategy is pretty well developed, too.

Roaches have been nerfed only slightly. Hydralisks are the new fad. But if you get both mixed, a Roach/Hydra army is very strong. Hydras have about 1.5 more range than a Roach with it's upgrade, so they safely stay behind the Roaches.

 

If you feel you are going to be overwhelmed by the enemies Hydra macro in ZvZ, be the first one to get Infestors for Fungal Growth along with creating your own Hydras. Atleast that's what I think will really help. Fungal Growth is amazing in ZvZ.

 

EDIT: THIS IS BETA INFORMATION.

INFESTOR FACT:

They can move underground when burrowed.

They do NOT regenerate energy when burrowed.

They MUST be above ground to regenerate energy and to cast spells.

They are VERY high threat to the enemy army (meaning their army will focus fire your Infestors if they get too close). Make sure they are kept safe behind your army.

 

^ im gonna try infestors next time I play

what I tend to do when Im playing is 6 pool, if it fails I go straight for hydras...is this solid?

 

I tried this. Better to get an extra Hydra for each Roach you would build, especially since they are same supply now.

 

If you are constantly fighting stopping to build hydras to make infestors is probably the death of you.

I would consider doing this only if in the last fight I managed to win with noticeable less loses but I am not confident on attacking his base yet. The extra troops at that moment can give me the needed extra resources I will need to get 2 infestors. I will need to make zerglings as well since infestors will eat up all the gas I would normally use to build hydras.
But getting two infestors costs me what, 9 hydras worth of gas? I am not sure they are worth it.

 

To Archangel;

Couldn't you just make an expo just for gas? I'll admit it's not a great solution, and probably not viable in some matches, but I figure it'll give you a gas boost and if it gets taken out, well it's 600 minerals gone. That's a chunk, but if it takes time for them to take it out I could see it easily being worth it, especially if you have extra material anyways.

I also have a question. I figured I'd ask it here instead of making another thread as it's a short-ish question.

Is there a good way to macro queens? I always find it distracting to have to go to my bases, click on my queen and tell it to inject my hatcheries. Do people normally have their queens on hotkeys? If so, how do they do it?

 

All of my Hatcheries are always hot keys. So, double tapping the hot key brings you to your hatchery. My queens are always next to their respective hatchery, so it' as simple as hotkeying to my hatchery, selecting my queen, prsesing 'V' and targeting my hatchery. It takes literally 2 to 3 seconds.

Be sure to set your rally points away from the hatchery so you don't have mass units/overlords hovering over your queen.

 

Fix:

They regenerate energy regardless if they are burrowed or not.

Add:

They have VERY LITTLE hps

They move VERY SLOW off-creep

They have VERY LITTLE range to use their abilities

but they are very cool Just got out of a non-ladder 2v2 where I went mass speedling/Queen/infestors (taking over the map with creep). Infested terran galore. Should have thrown spine crawlers in to the mix lol. I particularly loved it when the terran donated his BCs to me. Gotta love being able to mind control air now

 

No, I got your point. I think you're missing mine. 12/10 hatch doesn't net you any advantage over 14/10 to 16/18 hatch. The advantage you think you're gaining is nullified by the economy deficiency, later Queen, and unmaximized use of larvae (you end up with a lot of larvae sitting around not being morphed into anything).

As a result you end up out supplied, out resourced, and with less early defense at every point up through the 5 minute mark (at which point I stop counting because both have two hatcheries with two Queens at that point).

 

Okey, I stopped doing 12/10, and turned to 11/10 or I just make my overlord at 9/10 and do not do 11/10 at all.

What about this 2 hatcheries thing? I still think if you do it right (and your opponent does not rush you) you can come ahead of him.

 

I need advice from good Zerg players. At later/late game I am getting killed by Terran who masses Marauders and Medivacs. I tried Mutas, but they get killed by Thors. Hydras cannot do **** against this, banelings as well, they cannot do much to stimpacked marauders.

I tried upgraded Ultralisks with Tier 3 Zerglings and Hydras but still nothing. Only thing left are Broodlords but those take forever to get to and cost even more. And then if the Terran made a couple of Vikings your are screwed.

Also I hate the idea of needing to build the most Tier unit in SC2 to counter Tier 1 Marauders. It just is not right.