Why zerg sucks and I'm switching races.

Protoss are pretty difficult to play as well...

 

Heh, I think you're quickly becoming my favorite poster here Stirlitz.

I always hate building supply depots and pylons. They're so lame. Overlords are air units that I can use as scouts from the very beginning of the game. Later, they can carry units, spread creep, distract your opponent, and morph into overseers. Whether a zerg player spreads his overlords out and uses them to maximum effect or leaves them at the edge of the map behind his base tells you a lot about his skill level.

 

Ty for the support

 

Stirlitz, i absolutely hate your posts cuz as much as i want to read them, it really is a matter of

TL;DR​

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lol <3

 

With rage comes retardation.

 

We can never be sure which came first.

But the OP should go play terran as they are OP.

Amirite?!

 

No.

 

I play only zerg, in the first few days i switched around but couldn't get used to the other races and it it way easier for Toss or Terran to play. but a good zerg will know when to make what and as for the production make extra hatches when i have excess min, and keep them near queens. but i gotta to agree some Toss units need a nerf and some zerg units need buff like hydra hp, i mean t2 its p.o.s. in comparison. but they are getting there. Its getting closer to more balanced.

 

You do realise that roach/hydra beats straight up any protoss gateway units and in a cost-efficient way?

And just as a small comparison:

Hydralisk does 12 dmg/ 0.83 seconds for a total of ~14.5 DPS. Has a 2.25 speed buffed up to 3.375(iirc) on creep. Costs 100/50

Stalker does 10dmg/1.44 seconds for a total of ~6.95 dps(less than half that of a hydra) and has a 2.95 speed(more than hydra off creep, less than hydra on creep) half it's hp takes a fortune in money and ages in time to upgrade(plasma shields that is) so only weapon upgrades benefit it and armor or shields only benefit 50% of it's life.
+1 weapons gives stalker an extra 0.69 DPS. +1 Weapons gives hydra 1.2 DPS.
Stalkers can get blink, hydras can get burrow.



It's very wrong to compare units individually, but I just wanted to give you an example to show that zerg are quite cost-efficient and have a really strong army.

Just take a unit test map and try putting similar resource and tech levels of protoss vs zerg units and have them A-move against each other. The only time protoss will win is using mass colossi, but if you try adding broodlords or infestors(parasite) to the zerg army you're gonna turn the scales extremely easily.

 

Yes, but stalkers shred roaches vs. arm. Then when you add blink and chargelots it become even more difficult and i have yet to seen a toss player stick to just gateway units when the game goes on. They tech to Colossus and it almost a guaranteed gg for the zerg. Even if they do get corrupter s up its still hard to win because Corrupter s attack only air so once the Colossus are gone they are useless. And the blink is a plus more than burrow in my opinion because what does burrow really do for them? It hides them and they can't move nor do they receive a reg. bonus like roaches. I'm not saying every unit is OP, but some need a tweak. Also not all Zerg T2 is crap ,mainly hydra. They needs at least 100 hp i mean 80 really? and slow to reg. Stirlitz you make good points, I don't know Toss T2 as well but still have you seen many toss go only gateway cause I haven't but if they did yes it is the best build to go. I mean I'm not saying the game is seriously imba tot he other races its just at bit harder i my opinion, but I could be wrong.

 

Based on your first 2 sentences, i can say that you suck.

-Dont go roaches against stalkers if stalkers obviously counter roaches. Idiot.
-How about you add in hydras and infestors?
-Who the hell cares about colossi? neural parasite them, and use ultras, or hell, even mutas. maybe you just suck with corruptors. USE CORRUPTION
-dont qq about blink when stalkers are bout mobility and hydras are dmg. roches can move while burrowed freakin moron
-ARE YOU FREAKIN STUPID? Hydras, as you have seen, have MASSIVE DPS. zerg is a race based on mass, not another Protoss (although in starcraft 2....).

You are absolutely wrong. So is Blizzard.

 

Colossus are imo the weakest strategy against zerg... They work well in the start of the mid-game but become useless when a spire is out... And corruptors can evolve to broodlords which own pretty much everything in the protoss army, except for void rays(carriers don't do incredible dmg against units with inherent armor, and you'll need to tech up air weapons for them to be any good)...

Also, colossi can be neural parasited. Have you ever used Infestors against colossi? Yes they're an incredibly strong unit, so if you use it against the enemy you've pretty much won an overwhelming battle easily.

As for burrow, burrow movement is really effective against forcefields which is something the protoss army relies on(it's not just helpful it's a nessessity). If you don't get parts of your army sliced from forcefields because you burrow move, you've just wasted the usefulness of sentries...

Blink is really strong, but stalker without blink is a really weak unit relative to it's cost(just compare it to the hydralisk, for example. Or the marine(it costs almost as much as 4 marines and does about as much damage as 1 marine).

As for roaches: They get +2 points of damage per upgrade while stalkers only get +1dmg per upgrade and no increased damage against armored, they remain at +4 which at the endgame scales negatively.

A well-balanced zerg army mix is extremely strong against a protoss army, without even counting the zerg production capabilities in there.

What are zerg's main problems against protoss, usually:
Colossi: Just get either corruptors. Then if he keeps making colossi you'll kill him easily. If he stops making them he'll either tech to stargate or just go templar tech and use his robos to get immortals. Your answer? Make broodlords and stop making roaches and make hydra/ling for the ground. Or hydra/ultralisk.

I never see ultras against protoss yet they're quite an awesome unit. They tank tons of damage, are strong against any gateway units, including templars(size and speed makes them avoid storms easily and reduces aoe since most likely only 1 ultra will get dmged). Ultras also synergise well with broodlords and zerglings since they all use melee weapons for their damage, so you'll pretty much devastate any protoss ground army.


The only thing that worries you if you go ultra/broodlord is void rays: They'll tear you appart: Solution: If you scout a tech switch to stargate, save gas for hydras...


Really both races have good responses to each other's tech, with the only weakness I see is that protoss' only viable response to broodlords is VRs, since blink stalkers may be effective but they die too easily.

Also: infestors, they're like the most awesome caster in the game. Neural Parasite is extremely strong, and so is fungal growth(roots zealots and prevents stalker blink and colossus/immortal micro).


If hydras went to 100 hp then they would survive psi storm easily since 1 full storm wouldn't kill them, which means that once you had your corruptors out you'd be pretty much invincible against protoss since to kill your roach/hydra ball(which is extremely effective against any ground army appart from colossi) he'd have to spend extreme amounts of gas on templars which would limit his stalker/sentry count making him vulnerable to broodlords, ultras and mutas.


If you go zegling/hydra/roach against a colossusing protoss without bothering making corruptors or any other tech, yes you're dead. And so is a protoss that doesn't respond properly to your army build. Today I played a game against a zerg and scouted an extremely early roach warren. I didn't pay much attention to it and went on with my zealot/sentry mix, neglecting immortals/stalkers. When he attacked with ~35 roaches, I could do nothing to stop him. Are roaches OP? I don't think so. Maybe a tiny bit too cheap, but op, deffinitely not. I just responded badly to the scouting information I recieved and lost a game that I deserved to lose.


Also T1/T2/T3 doesn't really mean anything... It's not only what you can produce but also in what amounts you can produce it. Yes a carrier will come in the late-game, but if someone carrier rushes you, you can see carriers by the 7 minute mark. If you go fast lair and get an infestation pit for somehting like ling/infestor then it's easy for you to tech to a fast hive and get those ultras out, and switch to something like ultra/hydra/infestor/zergling really fast.

Teching takes money and time for every race. If you can survive and tech to something fast then you can get a good advantage over your enemy.

A protoss that goes 1base colossi is at a huge disadvantage in the early game since it costs him money,time, production facilities and an expansion to do that teching. If you scout him going fast colossi-which means that till he gets those colossi out and upgrades their range you have a very good window of opportunity to attack and do serious damage or take the game, he'll get an advantage and get a window of opportunity to attack you with his higher tech army, if he attacks before you get your corruptors out he'll do tons of damage or even win, if you manage to get them out in time then it's gone back towards your favour...


Using terms like Tier 1/2/3 is wrong because it kinda means that each race will fight the enemy race at the same tech level which is wrong.
You can tech, get an army or expand. Splitting the armies in tiers assumes that people tech at the same speed which is wrong.

Let's say your protoss opponent techs to carriers fast but also grabs a relatively fast expo. That means that for like 10-12 minutes he'll have a very weak army and all his economy will split between teching to carriers and saturating his mineral lines. If he gets carriers by that 12 minute mark and you have 3 working expos a roach warren and a hydra den you'll probably have a much bigger army than him too(because he also chose to expand instead of just rushing for those carriers) so you can attack and crush him. Does that prove that protoss Tier 3 is weaker than zerg Tier 2 cause roach/hydras own carriers? No, he just overstretched his economy too much.


As for the very late game, if we consider 2 races with all their tech buildings built and all their research upgraded, then zerg is deffinitely the strongest one because it has the most flexible production and change the army mix on the fly without bothering building more structures. Protoss or terran will need to have all their tech, all their upgrades AND a large amount of production buildings for EACH type which takes even more money.


So yeah, imo the whole thing is a little deeper, and a change should be seen based on what effect it would have on the whole game, including the strategic part of it.

If hydra hp was to be buffed to 100 then psi storm damage would also need to be buffed to 100 too, so that templar are viable against hydras when colossi are no longer an option, and that would mean that not only hydras but also roaches and ultras and broodlords and everything else would take 100 dmg per storm which would make all non-hydra zerg units weaker against templar, which in turn would lead to templar being favoured in PvZ and probably cause an imbalance in favour of the protoss. If storm remained at 80 then protoss would have virtually NO counter to Corruptor/broodlord play and that would mean that PvZ would be imbalanced in favour of zerg...


So, it's not really that simple...


Edit:

Don't be so rude, please, especially against someone who's just posting what he thinks without becoming offensive or rude.

Not all players are top diamond, in fact many players are in bronze and they don't macro well and make poor unit composition choices, do they have no right to post on a starcraft forum and voice their opinions and questions? Also replying like that scares people away, imagine if you'd been called stupid and an idiot by your 6th post here by an old member. Would you have kept coming around or thought instead "**** the retards, i ain't going in that place anymore"?

Tzone was wrong, but that doesn't mean he's either stupid or anything. Not everyone spends half their day thinking about starcraft, and not everyone has the game since launch - new players will keep trying out stuff that's wrong and fail and think it's an imbalance before they learn how they can react.

 

Stirlitz, i believe that happened on my second, third, fourth, and fifth posts.

And, yes, i totally see your point (not like i didnt b4 u told me, cuz its so obvious. i just didnt feel like not doing what i did )

I CANT BELIEVE I ACTUALLY READ THAT

 

*Block of text roll: 20, critical hit. 1n5an1ty suffers 120 points of damage and loses train of thought for the 1338th time*

 

Who is this Insanity?

 

Read again and don't try to cheat-dodge the hit. GM>rules and the dice showed a 20, so a critical success it is!

 

Guys. His trolling is growing to epic proportions because of your long posts. I mean I enjoy the show, I just thought I'd drop this piece of info.

I've learnt not to respond to people who don't understand the fundamentals of SC. I save a lot of time this way.

 

Nobody new to strategy games understands the fundamentals very fast, and some people are faster to grab new concepts that others. If they can learn then they can improve and start contributing themselves. When I started playing on september my understanding of SC fundamentals was just as bad, and I've also been a veteran SC:BW player, so I can imagine someone who hasn't touched strategy games at all and getting SC2 will have a lot more issues with learning it..

For example: Tzone's post on the "Zerg is underpowered" thread is the following:

It shows a lack of understanding how high tech units interact with production, but it's also far from trolling...

 

SC fundamentals as in a unit has strengths and weaknesses and that the aim of the game is not (necessarily) to outmass your opponent but to create the units that are best against theirs. If someone understands this they don't go saying things like the hydra needs more hp since the hydra wasn't designed to be hit but to be kept away from enemy fire by roaches/lings.

OK it might not be trolling as trolling implies a conscious taking the piss attitude while Zone's might just be a lack of thinking things through.