What's all the fuss about?

I didnt care if my units survived. As long as the mission was a success, it didnt matter to me how many marines and tanks were sacrificed.

 

Then you're doing it wrong. Go play WarCraft or something.


Why do you think every unit is so cheap? Why are the build times so fast? In skirmish matches the point is to smash massive armies against each other.



All you are is some stuck-up little TW fanboy. None of us here actually care about how much better TW is than SC (Supposedly). If you've come here with the insipid little idea of turning us away from StarCraft, go home.

 

Na i think he is genuinly worried about sc2 in this respect ;P. Regardless!

there is no denying that TW's unit models are so simply bad that its ridiculus to compare them to sc2's.
what makes it even funnier is that sc2's engine is gonna be capable of having even more (better looking higher polycount/higher res texture) units on screen at one time, than TW.

TW - http://games.rapidshare.com/games/2007/04/cnc_3/img/screens/full_size/1.jpg
SC2 - http://www.starcraftwire.net/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=755&cat=517

 

That's what Tiberium Wars looks like? It's so.....flat =|

 

I can't believe this hasn't been brought up yet.
The Universe!
The story!
The characters!
Your Tibirum Wars looks pretty bad ass, yes, but it is our world. Humans with tanks and planes. It's realistic yes, the graphics are very nice yes. But the game is less personal. Look at the view, which by default is further back than SC's is an excellent metaphor for what I'm trying to get at.
Starcraft fans have known these three races and the units and characters since 1998. It's a whole world full of intricate characters and a story(which ended with one hell of of a cliff hanger)
Also, in Starcraft each individual unit has personality. Each unit has a distinct, creative look (no Colossus = war of the world rip off retorts please.) Each little speaking portrait gives the unit further personality.
The game is comforting to play because it's so personal. Just watch videos side by side, you'll see what I mean.

 

Obvious troll is obvious.

Tiberium Wars = complete game
SC2 = alpha
think about it

Ea = Graphics > gameplay
Blizzard = Gameplay > graphics
Think about it.

 

sigh, graphics. while i do understand how people like eye candy, and that it effects how well the game is received sometimes, but it is the very least thing im worried or cared about in SC2.

looking at the two pics. that Babmer linked, i see the difference of the graphics, but i cant say which i like more because i dont care about graphics, in fact i dont care about how something looks 98% of the time. if you showed me a pic. right now i would most likely than not say that it looks ok(or nice) about 90% of the time. the last 10% is me not committing at all because i saw no point in doing so.

like Fenix and i said, it is still in Alpha, it could get a major overhaul before it is release. look at some of the pics of SC1 alpha and then look at its release pics, if you dont believe me.

if you were to argue gameplay mechanics then i might care.

 

http://www.starcraft2forum.org/forums/showthread.php?t=5785

 

Don't be so silly(of course it's flat, it's a city map!!), play the GDI campaign, it is always good to play other games so you have a proper basis for comparison, this is how you can perceive the quality and be able to know what the hell are you talking about and what is realistically expectable.


P.S.
Your signature made me think I had flies on my screen.>=\

So far I mentioned graphics/various effects(non existent in SC2), animation, veterancy and guess what- GAMEPLAY:

Can you tell me if in Starcraft 2 you can garrison buildings?
Can you tell me if you can garrison any vehicles(like APC or Hammerhead) creating many different combinations?
Do you have Zone Troopers drop pods(visually stunning btw)?
Can your infantry dig in?
Can tanks shoot while moving?
Can you drop sensor pods like Orcas?
Can you even upgrade your units?
Can you airlift various units, not just infantry?
Can you have artillery spotters for Juggernauts shoot over entire map?
Can you tell me if you have a variety of support powers?

And so on and so on...

Starcraft 2 is extremely simple substandard game(by all current information), so one would think it would have to have something that brings it up, but we can't see that happening, not in the graphics department, not in graphics effects department, not in animation department, not in gameplay department, MAYBE the story/non-linearity, but I doubt it.

Please do not double post.

 

lolwat

Double post arguments, FTW eh?

Hey you guys know that thing where you draw eyes on the side of your fist, then pretend to make your hand talk using the thumb as the lower jaw?

I think that's this here TW fan.

 

For Spaghetti Monster sake, I'm not a TW fan, I'm just showing(by using TW as an example) the lack of real substance in SC2 and how it doesn't par up with the current stage of RTS genre development.

Please watch your language. Strike 2.

 

my opinion on this is neutral, it would fit games where keeping your units alive is viable.

no.

no, but you can just get that combination from mixing units well.

Ghost has Drop Pod in single player.

no, Lurkers would be the closest thing.

the tanks cant, but Warp Rays can.

havent play TW, but just by the name i would say that Terrans Radar Tower and comsat is it.

yes, you can upgrade the weapon and armor of all your units, the Battlecrusier also can choose if it wants the yamato gun, or the missile aoe ability.

yes. all units can be transported

that itself is overpowered, more so if the Terrans had it then they just scan and fire.



each RTS shouldnt be to mush like the others, for if they are, then no-one would have need to buy any other RTS except 1.

 

I added this later, anyway, so much for gameplay depth...do you want to go back to graphics and animation now?

 

I am not going to say anything about veterancy - our forum's opinion is pretty clear and I summarized the arguments in an article (http://www.starcraft2forum.org/index.php?categoryid=8&p2_articleid=8).

Your arguments are futile, JackBlack. We are all here because we love the original Starcraft. We loved the three unique races, the designs of the units, and the easy-to-play-but-hard-to-be-good style of gameplay. Starcraft 2 is doing a wonderful job of staying true to the original while adding modern RTS elements and new gameplay options.

The graphics are fine. So what if they aren't the best? They still look pretty freakin' good to me.

The units are sweet - a great mix of old and new.

The gameplay is amazing. From all the videos I've seen, I can't wait for it to come out.

And again to reiterate - Starcraft 2 is not even out of internal alpha yet! The final game is going to look, play, and feel better than what we are seeing today.

 

All the things you list JB, like being able to garrison units in structures: Do you seriously consider all that stuff to be "the next logical step" for RTS's? Well it's not. An RTS doesn't have to have neutral buildings scattered over the maps to be captured by players. That's just TB's style of play. Haven't you noticed that you can't garrison units in DoW, even though that's an infantry heavy game? Well guess what: that's because it just didn't fit DoW, just like how it won't suit SC2.

 

support powers = to abilities, or special effects that units can do. lets see.

Protoss:

Zealots has charge which allows them to close the gap within seconds.
Stalker has Blink, allowing them to 'jump' small gaps, up and down cliffs, a small river, over a FourceField(will get to that in a moment)
Immortal has Harden Shield, any hard hitting units(has not been defined which units are hard hitting) will only do 10 points of damage against it shield, is one of two units that can survive a nuke.
Nullifier has FourceField allowing you to make 'makeshift' chokepoints, and Anti-Gravity, which disable any unit or building you choose, can also be used on Banelings so you can kill them to hit air units with an aoe.
High Templar is the same with Psi storm and holographs (cant spell the word i want)
Phoenix can hit multiple air units at once.
Warp Ray has a beam that gets stronger the longer it stays on one unit.
MotherShip acts a little like a pylon so that you can warp units to her, she can transfer her energy to other units, and has the Time Bomb ability that slows or stops all incoming fire.

Terran:

Marine still has stims
Marauder has a slowing effect on one unit.
Reapers can throw mines
Ghosts can detect units with energy, can snipe, can use EMP, and still has cloak.
Viking be a Ground or air unit.
Battlecrusier has that choice i told you before.
Nomad can lay down turrents, mines, and has an aoe defense matrix

Zerg:

Banelings will always explode even on death, does full damge through out all of its aoe, and will not hurt friendly units.
Roaches has a fast regeneration.
Corruptor has that 3-10 seconds buff that if the enemy unit dies within that time it becomes corrupted
Overlord can lay down creep allowing you to plant Nydus Worms and defenses where ever you want.
Overseer can bring fourth a changeling that looks like the enemy unit.
Infester still has dark swarm, can cast disease that takes something like 95% of the enemies health within 10 seconds and is contagious, they can also infest enemy buildings to make infested terrans.
Queen can deep tunnel, make morphalisks, can heal a building or unit, and can make the buildings into defenses.


am i missing any abilities? or special effects that units can do?

you can if you want to, but you know that i dont care for that stuff.

 

I think it's fun discussion. Don't see why we should ignore or cover the issue. Good to discuss things like this.

I don't even see the argument here. SC2 is the most advanced alpha I've seen in a long time, and I've seen quite a few. I've played C&C and I previewed Tiberium Wars. It was pixels and in primitive 3D at that point. As a comparison the beta of Tiberium Wars (because we never even saw alpha probably because it looked so terrible):



Just look at the Jeeps. They look terrible. No SC2 unit has ever looked like that. Even in concept.

Again, alpha. They're experimenting with the attack animations of all of these units. Why would they focus on things like environmental effects from their weapons?

Gonna try this one more time: alpha. Unit animations will not be perfected until at least the late stages of Beta. As someone else mentioned, why go through all that code just to redo it?

Sweet jesus, if you really lost zero units it must have taken you weeks. Why the hell would you care? This is exactly the problem. You must be terrible at these games if that is your focus. You could never, ever, ever win a SCBW game without losing a unit. It's impossible. Just like you couldn't win chess without losing a piece.

That's the difference between SC2 and other RTSs.

SC2 is a game of chess and strategy. C&C and other RTSs are Checkers. For the feeble minded who don't want to deal with the added dimension of strategy.

 

Thread should be over.
Jackblack, you cannot claim to know either or anything about the singleplayer campaign, and neither can we, regardless if there are features like such, they're sure as hell not going to be put into a multiplayer side of sc2 WHICH IS THE ONLY side we have seen. Ever wonder why TW failed as an E-sport graphicly?

The screen should be CLEAR units should be easily DISTINGUISHED, and the less crazy (but cool imo ;D) animations there are to "distract" the player in the multiplayer side of the game, the higher chance it will be sucessfull graphicly as an E-sport.

 

What is the point about multiple games with the same graphics, the same units, the same functions, the same options, the same effects, the same <insert random stuff here>?
There are differences between games and there always will be differences, anything else would become boring after some time. Like Aldaris says: "This isn't Warcraft in space". You should be able to replace the "Warcraft" with anything else.
Each games has its own elements special to that game; Warcraft has this, Starcraft has that, TW has something else and so on. For example SC with the hero system from WC would be more Warcraft in space than Starcraft. Mixing these games would be pointless because you would lose the elements people like about the single game in the progress (or you would create something totally awesome xD). If there is a wide variety of different games of the same genre you can choice your favourite of these games and simply ignore the rest.

btw. graphics? Who cares about graphics? Tetris has the lamest graphics ever and the gameplay hasn't change since ... uhh .. "several" years but still people play it.

 

I'm glad you posted that screenshot, it shows how much Starcraft 2 falls behind in the visual department. Although the screenshot doesn't show many other dynamic graphic effects and animation.(btw Scrin Tripod sooo owns Colossus in the animation department)

Support powers are not special abilities, I already mentioned special abilities previously, I would use that wording if I meant that. Support powers are also in Company of Heroes, it's basically options opened up by various buildings unique to not only each race but eatch faction, like EMP strike, bombardment, seeding, clustering mines(Nod Armageddon), pod dropping and lots of others.

That obviously can't be the point, I already said what the point is 2 times, you people really ought to read the topic before posting, not just the first page.

You talk about alpha, who would be stupid enough to post finished units and environments at the OFFICIAL page if they aren't finished already?
There are many stages and parts that are not related to the "alpha" designation.