The Zerg Roach

How is 8 damage adapting to anything when you can get handed to by a few Marines.
They should aleast make the Immortal strong it makes sense.

Anyway back to the Roach.

It seems to be an interesting unit and a backbone of the Zerg. It would be helpful to have a few with your Queen since they could absorb damage.

 

Hmmm.. agreed! And if anyone run by a video showing the Roachs in action, please link, 'cause I haven't seem them im combat except in the final conflict in the Zerg trailer... I wish I could see them im a multiplayer match ;-)

 

The adapting that they're referring to is probably the Blink, etc, so they aren't able to upgrade weapons. The reason it's doing less damage may be that the Zerg Carapaces and Terran Armour might have been improved so in effect, the attacks are doing less damage against them. Anyway, who knows. It's probably all going to change anyway and even if they don't, it's still going to be a balanced game.
About the Roach taking damage for the Queen, I don't really agree. They don't have any kind of Taunt ability so unless there's a physical barrier of Roaches between the enemy and the Queen, the enemy will still be able to attack your Queen directly.

 

No I'm saying you can just throw the Roaches at your enemy since they can soak up any damage given to them. That allows your Queen a better chance of surviving.
Gosh, not a barrier lol...

 

What are you talking about? I asked Jon, who has played the game, about the Immortals stats.
It has 20 damage and costs 175 minerals and 100 gas.
(those numbers are estimations)

 

Oh sorry. For some weird reason I took a trip to sc2armory. *blocks website*

 

You said that having Roaches with your Queen would be helpful because they can soak up the damage, but the enemy can still just run through your Roaches to rush your Queen.
sc2armoury.com says that the Immortal deals two lots of nine damage each attack, has 150 Shields and 150 Health, and costs 175 minerals and 75 gas, taking up three supply. Hardened Shields has to be upgraded.

 

I was just getting back on topic man.

 

That doesn't mean you can just type something randomly. You could just say 'but let's get back on topic guys'.
Also, you were right about the Immortal dealing nine damage, but it has two attacks making it eighteen damage per round.

 

Which means Immortals will be a goog counter against Roaches?

What is the Roaches damage?

 

Unupgraded, the Roach deals ten damage, meaning it's attacking to its maximum potential against the Immortal. However that doesn't necessarily mean that it will be effective against them. I'm pretty sure that Immortals will be able to take down a Roach fairly easily, but keep in mind that they're Tier 3 units or something, and the Roach is Tier 1.

 

They can be obtained pretty fast tho. Remember the video of Zerg v Protoss and by the time the guy got a Hydralisk the Protoss player had 4 Immortals. Also are you sure they are tier 3?

 

The Immortal is actually tier 2ish.

 

Ok, I wasn't sure, but I knew they were definitely later than Roaches. After all, it's hard not to be.

 

Well here's how I think it is.
Roach is tier 1.5 as we all know, while the Hydra is tier 2.
The Stalker replaces the Goon and is tier 1.5.
The Immortals require one more building after you have teched to Stalkers, making them tier 2.

 

GMG is right, they are Tier 2!

 

@ ItzaHexGor: but I'm thinking is that a Zerg might be kept inside his base more often if he's not able to deal with a cliff-crosser. Firstly, I think Blink might not be researchable but rather an always open skill. Don't see why it shouldn't, as the game is balanced to its presence, so it wouldn't hurt. Secondly, If a Stalker comes in and out of your base by ways which you cannot follow, you're trapped inside your base, held hostage to harassers that will take every opportunity to raid your workers in case your units try to leave and attack the protoss base. Unless static defenses are very effective against Stalkers, in which case I say no more. But strong defenses would ruin the harassing mechanic, imo.

You say Roaches being strong against Stalkers wouldn't be balanced, as they would be the counter to all early Toss units, but what I'm counting on is that Stalkers can cross-cliffs, and win based on that instead of direct confrontation. Zealots and Cannons are meant for direct confrontation. Stalkers could be meant for hit-and-run like no other unit ever created. Blink has such wide range of possibilities that I can see Stalkers using the enemy's own structures as a shield for them, and doing lots of wreckage regardless of what would happen in a direct confrontation with the Roaches. By blinking they can divide themselves into 2 groups and alternate which side of the base they're going to raid each time, and run when reinforcements arrive.

But as I wrote this post I come to agree with you more. I think Roaches shouldn't be it. The only way to stop harassment should be the Queen's micro, and she should be given means to do so. Not the Roach. I was so worried about Stalker's blink that I was thinking about units defending the base, but that's just me still thinking with SC1's head. *slaps the forehead*

@ everyone: Immortals are slower than Stalkers, and therefore would be cut open by mere lings in their path. Easily surroundable by their size, their shields would go down to fast hitters while they wouldn't focus-fire properly against many tiny units. I thought lings would be the counter to Immortals ever since the shield mechanics appeared. These ones would fall more easily than Stalkers.

 

Overling as far as I know blink is a research.
Those probelms you are talking about already existed in SC 1. It was very hard for the Zerg player to handle multiple drops at their expos, even thought he had sunkens and spores. 4 Storms and all the drones were gone...
But Zerglings are probaly killers against stalkers, as they kileld dragoons in SC1!
And the Zerg should not be on the defensive.
But I can see the problems, and Im not the fan of the Roach too, I dont think Zerg would need it if Hydralisks were Tier 1.5, and why should they after 4 years be much higher tier?

 

First off, you say that Stalkers should always have Blink and that would be balanced, but if units started with all these abilities, what would be the point in upgrades? If everything started with everything it would still be balanced, but there couldn't be any upgrades.
You say that having Stalkers being Blinked in and out of your base would be devastating, but they still can't do much damage to Zerglings. Zerglings are numerous and fast so can be kept throughout your base, easily able to ward off any Stalker raids.

 

Blink is a researchable upgrade. As is hardened shields.