The fate of the Ultralisk...

Give the Ultralisk a massive gaseous fart cloud like the Abominations, and then we can talk.

 

1 damage per second for 120 seconds? that nothing. besides, the upgrade costs a lot. it doesn't come with Disease Cloud
and, most of the units in starcraft are not organic

 

I didn't say it should be the SAME ability, just a similar one. Maybe its a corrosive fart cloud that disintegrates all organic and mechnical that come near it?

 

ultra should definitely remain at tier 3. I mean... it's ultra. I should be the pinnacle of Zerg ground might.

 

Ok my suggestions (if they even get read in this swamp of ideas):

No "ram" ability or farts, but "Cleave" or something similar would rock. Finally give the zerg some AoE (Terran: Siege Tank, Protoss: Psi Storm). Give the Ultra a 60-75% chance to hit units (and buildings) next to it's target. No splash, just AoE damage (so ev1 gets the same pwnage). Consider lowering the attack damage for this.
One could include "ram" into this; make the Cleave ability 100% on impact (would be hard to do those mechanics: what is "impact" exactly? Is it hitting the next siege tank in a row, or is it after you crossed half the map in full stride?)

Maybe a cooldown on "Cleave" would be nice, say 10-30 seconds, which the Ultras activates automatically. Or some sort of "adrenaline build-up" e.g. Cleave every 3 hits or so.

For all those people saying Trample on infantry: I wuld like to point out that fully upgraded Ultra's have 6 armors or so, making marines, zerglings, hydras e.g. hardly dent it. It is unstoppable vs infantry already. Add dark swarm, and you just got yourself some marine soup. DeeeeLicious.

That aside, it takes a skilled player to be able to counter air harass when using ultras. This really balances it I think. Also consider the effect of broodlings and irradiate on Ultras. There goes your 200/200 investment.

The real reason many Zergs don't utilize Ultras is the techage and time needed. Truly, I only use them when I either play on a money-map, or when I based my strategy on Dark Swarmage.

Thanks for reading.

 

That could be true, but read more thoroughly. I said a damage reduction would be in order should this be added.

Does that have to apply to SC2? And while I agree with the livability part of "tanks", it ain't like they soak up the damage. What I get is, I launch an assault (Ling-Hydra-Ultra), and the only thing left is ultras hacking away at buildings. They don't protect the rest, it's in fact the opposite. Exactly why they should assume a role as a damage dealer and priority target.

 

well if your going to compare ultras to tanks then look at the seige tank rofl. The ultralisk has about 4 times as much hp. The ultralisk is the best unit in starcraft for soaking damage, it also deals loads of damage when used properly because of its fast attack rate.
Considering the protoss now has a ground unit(collosus) with more hp than the ultralisk i think we will definately see a huge hp boost, probably around 800 hp.

 

Then we might just give it 25+ damage and rename it "Torrasque".

 

I was not comparing ANYTHING to Siege Tanks, "Tank" is a term for something sturdy. Hmmk?
Next, why should the Ultralisk have the highest HP of all SC units. I think that one of the downsides for Ultra is that it gets in the way and deal little damage for cost (it's far more effective to swarm with lings or hydras). That's why we need damage, not livability.

 

I think he was commenting on the fact that siege tanks (despite having tank in their name) are not tanks in the sense that ultralisks are (they are not damage absorbers).

How about giving ultras that ability the mountain giant has that makes nearby units attack him. wreaks havoc on micro.
"NO I don't want to attack that dammit"

 

i don't get it whats abzerg ??? like mine ;D

 

I think the Ultralisk is definitely going to stay. They are probably going to have a new ability much like how the Zealots got the new Charge ability.

The trample idea sounds like a very good idea. They are big, and should do splash damage. But thinking about it, that sounds too much like the Archons. I would actually give the Ultralisk a different passive ability. Maybe a passive that has a % that would bash the unit they are attacking and send them backword?

And as someone pointed out, since the Collossus have huge amount of HP, I see some sort of HP upgrade for the Ultralisk. They were the ultimate sponge units in SC, and should also be the case for SC2.

I also can't wait to see what the new Ultralisk is going to look like in the 3d engine. Hopefully, we can see them in action at BlizzConn.

 

I hope they dump ultras and surprise me with something else, ultras really sucked hard.  No other unit in the game was built for the sole purpose of to tank and die without any other incentive or usage at all.

Just in case ultras do make it back, let me throw my ideas on ways of improvement out there too.

Ultras definitely need a boost in their offensive capabilities.  If a damage boost will be too overpowering, which isn't what I want, then it should at least be done indirectly. 

My idea on how to do this is to give ultras a passive ability that lowers the armor of the target unit or building by 2 or so, including negative armor.  This should only last just barely longer than ultra's attack cooldown so you can't have ultras running around tagging everything in sight.  I think it makes sense for the behemoth units to be able to deliver crushing blows to units and buildings making them more open to attacks from other units.  Crushing blow, pulverize, whatever you wanna call it.

If Blizzard sadly decide that they still want ultras to play like how they did in SC1 then it will suck and be a sad decision.  But here are some ideas to improve ultras even in that case, to make them better at how Blizzard wants them to be.

DEVOUR:  Eat a friendly ground unit and gain HP equal to 50~75% of the target's current HP.  Not the kodo ability.  More like consume except you get HP instead of energy, like eat tree or death pact.  This should have a short cooldown if at all.

GORGE:  Passive ability.  Ultralisk takes a bite out of any target on every attack(doesn't have to be that way graphically) mechanical or otherwise and gains back a small amount of HP each time.  Basically a leeching attack.  This too, will aid in ultra's tanking.

BASH:  Passive ability.  Ultra stuns its target for just a moment on every hit, preventing any movent or attack/abilities.  Basically allowing each ultra to effectively disable one ground target unit/building.

I also thought that mountain giant's taunt could be nice for ultras.  Anyway, just some ideas.

 

Lol, it could be soo much simpler remy, just give them cleaving damage (In case you don't know, it's melee version of splash damage basically). It would be in theme and easy to manage. Bash would be pointless because they'll likely be getting killed by smaller units so being out numbered, devour is okay but it would make it imba if you have overlords on the waiting as healers basically, and micro would make it more so, and gorge doesn't make sense if the enemy's not made of flesh and blood, so it could be very easy to counter.

 

I hope nothing in SC2 stuns. It's a bad mechanic especially if it were put in SC because everything has less HP in SC so it doesn't last as long as in WC3. So, if something is bashed, it's basically dead.

Anyways for ultras I would say cleave and taunt and something like devour so it can tank better.

 

Yea I know cleave, I played WC3. I don't like cleave for ultras over armor reduction. There is a difference.

Massing ultras that all have splash damage could be a problem, this goes against Blizzard's aim of unit mixing. Depending on what you fight against you could be pretty effective with just ultras for the most part. But armor reduction debuff means that you'll have to have other units attacking to take advantage.

Bash is more for taking out bunkers/cannons out of the picture, but yea largely useless I agree.

Gorge doesn't have to be bio-only, spawn broodling eats through metal to get inside. Even real life alligators can already digest metal, let alone mutant Zerg.

I don't understand why you say devour would be imbalanced. You can't really ovie drop units for consumption in the heat of battle cuz ultras are frontline units. If you do it after fights it's the same as building fresh ones cuz you're killing your other units in the process, so basically you're paying for HP. Even if ultras ate a ling/hydra every few seconds, you can still take them down with focus fire. If ultras are not drawing fire, then it is already to the Zerg's disadvantage cuz it defeats the purpose of getting them in the first place.

 

Well, there has to be at least a cool down. It's hard enough to kill a death knight, now imagine ultralisks, which is usually paired up with masses of zerglings anyway, and now that spell casting for units would be much better streamlined (I'm assuming similar to warcraft 3), it would mean you could just press a key and press a zergling. I also wouldn't argue that it is imba except since one of the major disadvantages of ultra is that it is melee, and therefore damage dealing is limited to the first layer of the army, it makes it much more advantageous to be able to have a front line that doesn't die. Granted this is a defensive modification if anything so it is hard to discuss it in parallel with cleave.

It is also because of this that cleave makes ultra's offensive potential much, much higher. If it's dealing with ranged units, it wouldn't matter as much because damage would come the same either way.

With your modification of armor, it would be advantageous especially if hydralisk is paired up to provide damage. It also means its potential is reduced for killing smaller units (since most of the ranged hits would be wasted in ff), and also it would mean swarm is going to have a hard time playing its role as well. To simplify everything, I still have to say that cleave would be the most effective under the theme of quantity over quality, and economy over micromanagement.

 

I say, based on a conglomeration of sorts of all the ideas here, is that to give the Ultralisk a very high HP (800 like Terrosaque) A reasonable standard base damage (40 + 5 per upgrade = 55 in total, capable of killing a marine in one slice), and 3 standard Zerg Carapace, 1+ per upgrade, maybe the return of the extra armor upgrade, 7 armor in total.

It's special abilities:
Stomp, capable of stomping within it's melee range (creating splash damage too, not enabling the enemy units targeted to attack maybe? Oh yeah that's right, that's STUN! ;D) for around 40 or so seconds (with perhaps 40 second cooldown timer), for each 2 hp of an enemy ground unit stomped 1 hp of the Ultralisk is lost, around 40 stomps may be achieved within 40 seconds. (So if a "group" of Marines are targeted, 40 stomps, Marines die, say 4 Marines, 40 x 4 = 160/2 = 80 HP loss for the Ultralisk (maybe not minus the armor), which is reasonable, capable of regenerating half that amount during timer... (if not under attack still)

Leap, the ability to leap from higher ground to lower ground. (Zerglings will have this ability too)

Cliff climb (for lack of a better word), the ability to climb cliffs, but at a slower rate as leaping off it?

 

i dont like the losing health part of stomp, since ultras would be under focused fire, losing health while stomping would destroy it.