SHOULD blizzard impliment veterancy for terrans?

not all races should have it, only terrans should have it, this will further distinguish the different races. and it's easy to balance

 

Id say yes, even though there might be a small advantage for the terrans, the upgrades would be minute. Like +1 or +2 damage or something...i mean you gotta reward a terran for all his hard work in the field. You could maybe only implement this on marines or firebats or something. Because i mean marines are pretty much cannon fodder anyway so what if they have a slight advantage, there gonna die in the next few minutes anyway. And well you might be able to do this with the zerglings and zealots i dunno i mean just make em a little stronger...that way you would be rewarded for keeping your troops alive and stuff. Ah well we shall what desicion blizzard makes.

 

First of all, please don't post if all you have to see is, 'OMFG IT'S 2 CNC!!!!!1!1!!' or, 'Noo0o0000o WAY 2 PWERFLLL!!!1! IMBA!!!1!'

It's so insignificant to actual gameplay it is almost an aesthetic change. If it is implemented, there are sure to be games where not a single unit reaches veteran status. Not only that, but even if the upgrades were something significant and unrealistically strong, it's not going to have a noticeable impact on the game because:

1. No matter what the upgrade does, you will probably have access to a more powerful unit anyways through normal production means (e.g. You have a veteran marine, but you can build vikings.)

2. Very few, if any, of your units will ever reach veteran status. None will in the early part of the game, where it arguably would have the most impact.

3. If you are able to accumulate a large number of veteran units, you've probably won anyways, as you've killed five/ten/twenty times that many enemy units.

As far is it not 'being starcraft,' well this isn't starcraft. It's starcraft 2. Things are gonna change, it's not gonna be exactly the same as the old game. I mean who can imagine starcraft without dragoons or wraiths or firebats. But we have it, and apparently it still feels like starcraft to those who've played it. You have to wait at least until you've played the demo before you can say that it's no longer starcraft, or that something is not starcraft-esque.

 

Make me happy and say that it's ONLY an aesthetic thing and I will leave you alone. Otherwise this is going to throw off ALL early gameplay. Don't tell me it's "almost" insignificant because there is no such thing.

In a chemical structure if even the tiniest component moves, it has changed the makeup of the entire atom along with its properties.

 

well, the now scraped soul hunter had a veterancy system where it would do more damage the more units it killed, i think the main reason they scraped it wasn't because they didn't want leveling up, but that it could kill ur own units and make it more powerful, and blizzard didn't want people warping in zealots just to be killed by the soul hunter

 

I don't care either way as long as it is implimented well

 

I liked the Soul Hunter version of 'Veterancy' for StarCraft II. I think that it made sense, and it wasn't too Command and Conquer-ish. I don't think that the Terrans should have it specifically, but maybe just one or two units in each race (in some form or another)

Good poll choices, by the way. It actually didn't seem biased.

 

i agree graham its another reason why it got cutted besides not just protoss material

 

well said! its not imba. and this is starcraft 2. CnC rely much on veterans well as for starcraft its just a minor advantage for the terran. its the FEEL that it gives that matters. make starcraft 2 more exciting!

and i think the soul hunter was axed 75% because of the look of the model.

 

naa i still rkn not in the sc2 world..

it just doesn have the "feel"

..........actually.....naa im gna stick with my mind ...it doesnt have the "feel" man!!
>.<

lol...

 

It can't throw off early gameplay. I explained this, in the post above. You won't have any veteran units in the early game. It would take about ten kills to get veteran status. Your early units won't have the capability to kill that many units before other more powerful units are available. Think about it, the only way a marine would be able to get ten kills is if it's in a bunker. If it's in a bunker, the bunker itself would need to kill 37 units (ten for the one marine, nine for all the others, as the kills are evenly distributed, I believe).

By that time both player's should have access to more powerful units than an upgraded marine anyways. At the very least, you should each have enough units that one upgraded marine is not going to make a difference. And even if it does, well thats what you get for letting one bunker kill 37 of your zealots. Not to mention that you're already down by a crapload of minerals and units at that point, so you've probably already lost.

I don't see what's so hard to understand about it...

 

If its so hard to upgrade then why implement a bonus at all?

If you say it's aesthetic I have no problem with it.

Even giving someone the OPTION of making their unit more powerful, say even in Late Game, they kill a number of units and slowly gain miniscule amounts of strength. But still enough to gain a larger advantage.

BTW, the point is moot since there's a 60% majority that says I'm right. Lol.

 

60% people don't like the veterancy idea, not 60% people saying you are right about it affecting early game.

your arguments are illogical, they are always along the lines of a single unit killing x number of units and becomes too powerful. but do you ever think why that unit should have the right to kill lots of units without dying itself? it's not like if he's a god. only bc, archon, carrier and ultra have some survivability, other units die fast. why do you always think +1 damage on a single unit is going to completely f**k everything up?

even if you do mange to archive the x number of kills with a single unit then your are clearly the better player and have already established the upper hand. the promotion is insignificant.

the reason i want this feature is it'll be good in the map editor where the numbers and powers of the ranks can be edited, also because the mechanics already exists, other races could use it in the map editor.

 

The SC2 map editor will be able to do things like that. Without sticking some stupid veterancy system in the entire game. There was an interview or something. Search around if you want to.

 

Actually, Reaker, before you call my arguments illogical, I think you need to ask the opinion of a player who has played in tournaments.

You are the one disillusioned about early game play. The only thing that saves your idea is the fact that you say only 10 kills or so will give a promotion. It is unfair early game in that it heavily favors micro players even more than before.

Being good at micro does NOT make you a better SC player. You have to be good at both micro and macro to win consistently. Therefore, giving units promotions only further skews the game in the early tiers more toward micro players and gives a more macro player less of a chance to survive first tier gaming.

Also, you're forgetting one of the longest-lasting units in the game: Seige Tank. A lot of seige tanks tend to sit on defense and aren't put on the front lines but rather used as support weapons. It is also the most powerful early Tier 2 unit and a good example of why it wouldn't make any sense. The only way this would work is if it was an aesthetic change. You're not thinking in terms of game balance, or reason for that matter since you constantly refuse to address the issues I place before you and adapt your argument. Instead you just say I'm illogical. I think we both know that's not true.

Also, 60% against your idea is the same as 60% agreeing with me in saying that it should not be implemented. Make a poll about whether people think it will imbalance Tier 1 play. Then we'll see what the general consensus is.

 

First of all a vote means nothing. I'm sure if you took a vote in 1400, most people would agree the world is flat. It's a common logical fallacy, appeal to the masses.

Second of all, a moot point is an unagreed point, so I don't know what you're talking about there.

Third, I don't care if you play in starcraft tournaments, it has no relevance to the topic at hand. It is a non sequitur.

Otherwise, all of my previous arguments remain unchallenged.

 

i voted no

 

they had this in an early stage of alpha.. it was a terran repair building it was very soon taken out of the game ill post a screenshot if i can find one

 

People above this post,

Please do not post if you have nothing to say. The poll's votes are displayed to everybody, so there is no need to tell us for whom you voted. As for the repair thing... I don't even know what you are saying or how it is relevant to this thread.

:bad:

 

... wow....

Anyway, back to the discussion.

@ Nukem , it definitely has an effect if you're playing in tournaments. You can't change the gameplay style for tournaments. It has to be the original game with or without the terran promotions. If you could show me a mechanical reason that would require balancing for the Terrans, then I might agree. As of now, with the status quo in SC1, the Terran units are no weaker. So giving them a small, even insignificant boost, isn't going to solve any problems, but only create some.

An aesthetic ranking I can see, but no further than that. Otherwise you're just messing with the gameplay for no reason. I mean if you really wanted to do something with it, why not have a unit that gets promoted to Commander be able to issue some kind of order, like "form up" and all the units around it form a column....

What I'm saying is that if you offer even the ability to change the strength of a unit even a tiny amount in Tier 1 gameplay, no matter if its easy to attain, will still change the face of the gameplay and offer an advantage to players that already possess a certain skill, and detract from players who have a different, but equally important (in SC1) skill that comes later in the game.

My basic point is that (from SC1) one dragoon can be used to kill another Dragoon effectively with Micro. It can be done so that it sustains little or no damage in the process. This means that if you're willing to spend the time to do so, you can use one unit to kill a LOT more than you previously could (if this promotion system is instated).

I have nothing left to say on the matter. I've covered your points and tried to make my point clear to you as many times as I care to. I'm not saying you CAN'T do it, but it doesn't make any sense to. And it would change the gameplay. Even if just a tiny bit, it would still change the overall mechanics and create unforseen problems on top of the ones I'm describing.