Roach Regeneration vs Psi Storm

Roach rushing will be a problem, yes, but it won't be worse than Zergling rushing. Rushing it just getting to the enemy before they've got the firepower to stop it. Marines have Bunkers, which can be repaired and stop their Marines taking damage so the Roaches will have a hard time getting though. Also, Roaches require both a Roach Den and an Extractor so they'll be harder to rush before your opponent can defend themselves. Five Stalkers will one-shot Roaches. They do twenty damage each, plus a bonus to Armoured targets which I'm fairly sure the Roach is, so seeing as Roaches only have ninety or so health, they'll be taken down almost instantly. Also, all teams have ways to prevent dancing. Terran have long range, Marauders and can one-shot them with Siege Tanks, which also have extremely long range, and Protoss can Blink after them with Stalkers and walk over to them with Colossus. Again, they're fragile. If the opponent focuses fire, the Zerg player won't have time to dance them.

 

Ok here's the problem. You keep mentioning units that counter them without taking into account that those units are nowhere near available when roaches start popping out. If the bonus and armour type you're saying is true then 5 stalkers will indeed one-shot roaches but then again roaches can focus fire as well and even if you lose only 1 stalker the dance with roaches can be executed with full effect because stalkers won't have blink to chase them down that early in the game. The only viable defense is the bunker, but only if you can command the building to focus fire. Terran will have the marauder for offensive countering but Protoss can't defend nor attack against those buggers, IMO. Maybe anti-grav if it's still at the nullifier (I can't quite keep track of that and the HT).

 

I've mentioned units that come later in the game but I've also mentioned earlier ones. The later units aren't the only counter. Terran have Marauders early on, which have a bonus against Armoured units, longer range and also slow them down, preventing dancing. Protoss have Stalkers early on, which have a more powerful and slower attack which is more effective against Roaches than quicker and faster attacks, like that of the Zealot, and also have longer range. I don't think the bonus against Armoured units really matters with the Stalker as their base damage is twenty at the moment so five would still be able to one shot a Roach. The Roaches may be able to focus fire as well, but they wouldn't match the focus fire damage of the Stalkers. Blizzard has told us that with five Stalkers versus five Roaches, Stalkers will win with little micromanagement. It will be hard to dance with Roaches against Stalkers because Stalkers have a longer range than them. The Roaches may be able to dance, but so will the Stalkers, breaking up the Roaches focused fire.

 

But dancing in the case of roaches not only breaks the focus fire on them but also allows them to regenerate a lot of hp, which can't be said about the plasma shields. And I forgot about the additive bonus in SC2 when taking the 5v5 stalker-roach battle. 20 base plus bonus is quite a lot that early in the game, even if medium armour doesn't get as big a penalty as heavy.

 

Itza, Psion, come on I can't believe you aactually got into an argument over that. Anyways it's over now, look through the thread the argument never happened, and it should stay that way. Psion you really shouldn't have taken so much offense at a simple request like Itza was making, it looked like he was just trying to help at first. Itza Psion's post is fine the way it is because the whole thing is in effect a quote and both the first and last sentences confirm that, if he wanted to interject his own opinion into the post he would have to do something to delineate the quote from his own words, but thats not the case here. So this argument is over now, correct?

As for what this thread is actually suppose to be on, I think the Roach could very easily become overpowered, but I believe if that happens Blizzard will just tone down the regen and the problem will be solved.

 

I didn't take offense to the requestm I took offense to the fact he seemed to be accusing me of trying to take credit.
Argument over.

But they said when they tested it, the Roach can be beat with simple micromanagement, I don't see what the problem could be but yea, if there was a problem all they'd have to do is decrease the regen rate.

 

Awesome! This means the roaches will be some of the few ground units to be able to survive a psionic storm and the roach has a very high regeneration rate. Me likeee
.

 

yup they do say that a few micromanagement will take out a few roach, but say a numeber of roaches with lurkers & infestors dark swarm??? perhaps theres a new bug in town that'll keep you guys on practicing unit management even harder lolz ^_^

i like the way they endorsed the roach, as of now it is a really very promising unit.. lets just hope itll live the hype though.. coz im just as excited as a kid seeing how good these roaches will come into play

 

Yeah I'm fine to leave it there. The text wall was in response to his accusation after I answered his previous question which, just for the record, didn't accuse him of trying to take credit at all.

@ kuvasz. Dancing the Roaches, although obviously yielding greater results than dancing the Stalkers, will be much harder because the Stalkers are basically one-shotting them, and on top of that they have longer range meaning that the Roaches can still be attacking while retreating.

I seriously don't think that the Roach is overpowered. You might be able to put forwards a whole lot of scenarios, like Roach rushes and mass Roaches but there are always ways to counter them. Besides, if they were overpowered, do you think Blizzard would give them an upgrade to further enhance their regeneration rate?

 

If I were you, I wouldn't question Blizzard's ability (and tendency) to implement stupid things
Also, I have yet to see an official text about burrow being moved to tier 2. If it's tier 1 then there's no need for dancing at all. And since the burrow mechanic has been greatly improved (much shorter cooldown before and after burrowing/unburrowing), roaches, with decent micro, could prove very imbalanced.

 

Blizzard may do some stupid things, but if the Roach is so obviously overpowered due to its regeneration rate, they wouldn't give it an upgrade to increase it.

Burrow may be tier 1, but so are Phase Cannons, and I'm yet to see a Protoss player that didn't have at least a few Photon Cannons hanging around their base, so I assume it would be the same with Phase Cannons, so that excludes the possibility of Burrowing to escape Stalkers, especially if the Roaches are being one-shotted. Burrowing also takes time and a fair bit of gas as well, which the Roaches also need, so trying to mass them, or just creating a lot of them, with Burrow would require a lot of gas.

 

I remember Blizzard saying either in a video or blue text that Burrow had been moved to tier 2 and is researched at the Evolution Chamber, but they did so because of Baneling use and Queens. Something like that... not entirely sure.

 

They just said Burrow is at the Evolution Chamber. They didn't say anything about it moving up in tier.

 

We'll see.