Marine

the bayonet will be an addition to the marine's equipment. we are not asking for it to replace the gun, you can still fire it close range if you want but every bit of sharp metal or whatever high tech weapon helps in a fight to death. like i mentioned before, there are scenarios where the marine don't even need to consciously do anything for the zergling to be impaled on the bayonet. and that helps a lot in the heat of battle, where everything may just seems like a blurr.

 

I think your logic is the closest thing I can come to terms with. This can't go on any longer anyway, or I'll have to close the thread.

But I thought the way the marine's rifle worked, there is almost no recoil anyway. But either way, your argument is slightly flawed BoP. The power suit would either be barely good enough or pretty damn good. If it is lacking enough for the marine to have trouble using the rifle without careful positioning, it would also not be good enough for a marine to go up against zergling/zealot in close quarter combat. If it's so good that it allows the marine to have a fair chance against zergling/zealot face to face, it would also allow the marine to handle the rifle without trouble. The rifle looks pretty short in relation to the power suit anyway.

 

The rifle already does benefit from sci-fi goodness... it can fire in pretty much any environment.

And your understanding of weapons tech is flawed from the last several hundred years of human history. Shooting is NOT always better. In fact the truth is the exact opposite. A melee weapon of equivalent tech will ALWAYS do more damage than a ranged weapon.

A melee weapon can inflict greater damage due to both increased size of the effective area of the weapon, and direct application of its damage. A range weapon may put a finger sized hole in a creature - but a melee weapon can put a fist sized hole in a creature. A range weapon may wound a specific spot on a creature - but a melee weapon can slash across and wound an entire area on a creature.

The benefit of ranged weapons is not increased damage output... it is that they can do their damage output before the enemy is capable of endangering YOU with any danger output of their own. But if your ranged weapon is useless at stopping the enemy from closing.... a melee weapon of equivalent tech will always provide more damage output at close range.

 

that's not necessarily true, there are ranged weapons that are really powerful, like the .5 caliber. if you get shot in the head by one of those your whole head and half of your upper body will literally turn into a bloody mist.

also i don't think it matters whether melee or ranged weapon is more powerful, like i said, we are not replacing the gun with the bayonet, we are adding it. the marine can shoot and stab at the same time if he wants, the bayonet also acts as a defensive barrier, controlling the space in front of the marine. no conscious action is required on the part of the marine for the the bayonet to be useful in this role.

 

it is true... there are two qualities - the ability to cause harm, and the ability to do so at range

while a .5 caliber is very powerful, a buzzsaw can do the same thing, and much less expensively... if you design a melee weapon with the same level tech as is currently used on guns - it would do more damage output... nobody bothers with that however, because it's not necessary for attacking humans

and yes, I'm not suggesting replacing the gun - I'm just explaining why it would be useful to have both - the gun is good because it can shoot things before they get close... a bayonet is useful because it can finish things off when they get close

 

obviously you would not be suggesting for the replacement, i just feel that you should point it out more in your arguments

 

so natesmz , by your post would it be better if the gun shot sharp boomerangs that slice through the enemies?

 

i think that would fire too slowly plus the boomerang might damage yourself

 

no... =/

the point was this: a sharp stick that you stab somebody with will do more damage than a sharp boomerang that you throw at somebody

likewise a high tech device that you smack somebody with will do more damage than a high tech device you shoot somebody with

that should be commonsense physics...

ie: I have a 100 pound rock and a 1 pound rock... now obviously I can throw the 1 pound rock a lot farther than the 100 pound one.... but if you get close enough for me to hit you with the 100 pound one... it would do a LOT more damage

 

you guys are too nerdy. in the age of personal shields, massive spaceships that fire huge lasers, and xenomorphic feral aliens, you argue about .50 caliber bullets?

 

Yes, since that's the proven and tested method for killing anything.

 

These discussions about bayonet are killing me. Lets talk about something else.

What do you think about the new Marine design? Is there anyone here who likes the SC1 design better? I think that marine power armor from SC1 is just about the best damn armor I have ever seen in my life. The SC2 marine looks completely unoriginal, like a bland copy of the SC1 design. It just looks so uninspired with those silly, gigantic fists, legs that look more like actual human boots than a piece of futuristic power armor, that gun which looks just like another one of those "omfg roxor" big gunz we see in every other video game, and the rest of the armor isnt much better. As if someone took the SC1 marine and mainstreamed the design to make it look less serious and more amusing, so to say, maybe to make it appeal more to the younger audience.

For reference start your Starcraft and run original SC singleplayer. Then put your cursor over the terran marine and take a good look. Now compare it the marine in this pic: http://eu.starcraft2.com/images/wallpapers/wall4/wall4-1024x768.jpg
edit: fixed the link

 

There is no Marine in that pic.

And the new Marines look pretty awesome as is. They look just as intimidating as the old Marines, I see no problem with it.

 

Marines are kinda small and you should not care to much about big hands, since you shouldn't look at em up close, but more like in groups.

And that picture shows a big Starcraft II logo. I feel ripped off of my expectations.

 

Marines look fine... they are one of the most similiar-to-SC in terms of the new units.

 

did you never see the old sc1 cutscenes? it's the sc1 marine design with more wires showing.

and zerglings do a good job of proving how good a sharp object is.

 

EVERY weapon has recoil.  Recoil is not something that happens just in explosively propelled weapons (bullets) but would also happen in rail guns for the fact that as the railgun pushes the bullet forward inertia of the projectile would cause the propulsion to force the weapon backwards.  This was true about crossbows is true about guns is true about railguns.  It is a fundamental law of physics.  Technology will not get rid of recoil unless it becomes advanced enough to change the laws of physics.
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I like the SC2 marine more. It actually looks like a hefty suit of armor. The old SC1 power armor wasn't all that thick (no wonder marines die so quick) On a similar not I like SC2 Zealot power suits better since they cover more of the zealot. Remember in SC1 there was bare skin on the arms and waist (where was Fenix cut in half at? The waist {uncovered} and he lost an arm {uncovered}). Now covered. It shows design evolution because the ow were more armor and are less likely to get cut in half. IOn a similar manner the Marine suit is more heafty and the larger gloves and arms allow him to hold a bigger gun and serv to add more protection

 

You presume though that the fundamental law of physics applies to all weapons of the Universe in which Starcraft is situated. Albeit most weapons in Starcraft are either manifested or generated. We never did see the Marine actually recoil or the Ghost's rifle really recoil when fired. I would just try to avoid the whole idea of realistic physics other than basic ones.

 

Atleast in the case of the marins i would imagine that there suits absorb most if not all of the recoil so the marines can aim better for a longer period of time.

 

Remember though the situation I posed was not when the butt was to the marines shoulder like normal ut shooting from the hip due to a 'ling being closer than the gun length