looks like Karune went and answer quetions today for the update

the Thor is still odd....but it can attack air and ground which is good enough for me to know

 

You obviously do not read my friend. The Broodlings timer runs out very fast. That strat would work best while in confrontation, it would use it valuable APM while doing so, so it isn't that great of a pro.

 

No, I said that you can attack your own Roaches all you like, but they will die by the time they even engage the enemy forces. Would be a waste of time to do that, really.

 

Thats actually an interesting tactic, let Roaches frontline which Guardians feed the attack by attacking some Roaches in the background, instead of them getting shot at.

 

Yes, take the credit without mentioning my name! *runs away crying*

I think it'd only work if the timer on the broodlings made it possible to muster a broodling army out of battle, which is not the case.

 

That could work, if you want to keep the Swarm Guardians out of range of the enemy to save them, and just use them as Broodling fodder, but I'd rather use them to do some damage to the enemy instead of just make some diversion. I guess that's a good idea if you know you can't win, but then why fight the battle anyway?

 

i know why they keep insisting gta role for the thor. because they are afraid a gtg exclusive thor especailly when mass will make all other terran ground forces useless (no need for marine + marauder combo, ghost, viking, and maybe even siege tank. just like when you mass carrier, you rarely see it with other protoss spacecraft.

but come on. it can't attack air unit. its slow. not necessary to mass since its expensive and takes a lot supply etc. and its a late game unit. cut the ground bombardment and give it a new ground ability, like this http://larcenciel-11.deviantart.com/art/new-thor-the-perfect-role-84984812 so that it wont overlap with the siege tank. there.

is it really necessary to make a goliath replacement? just bring back the predator, or remodel the jackal give it gta, give the jackal flamethrower to the reaper. but please dont sacrifice the thor.

i just dont understand blizzard why they really want the thor to be a strong gta unit. mech are suppose to be a powerful ground assault force except for dual roles like the goliath. lorewise sometimes becomes bad just for the sake of gameplay balance and perfection.

 

@ Neon
I don't believe recall is in.
I belive the MS creates a warp matrix field


Dark swarm was mentioned
What unit has it?

 

What, exactly, is a "warp matrix field?" anyway?

When he says, "teleport whole armies to your location" mentioned separately from warp-in sounds a whole lot like Recall.

I believe it is the Infestor that has Dark Swarm. Jon said it was on the unit when he played the game.

 

yes the Infestor has Dark Swarm, which is a tier 2 unit and it comes out with Dark Swarm, so Terrans are going to have more trouble with zerg players earlier in the game.

 

Warp Matrix = Pylon Power

A noticed a few weeks back they mentioned that the mothership acts like a pylon so you can use warp in under it. Pretty sure it was in one of the Karune FAQs

and what is the warp-in description? Something about warping entire armies wherever you have power

 

zzzz....im still iffy about the thor...
i know its hard to balance...but y dont blizzard just give it some laser beams for gtg and magnetic distruptors for gtA or something....
something that will change its role to other terran units...

....
i know!! how about...yeah give it a nice laser beam for gtg...and still give it a nice gtA..like a magnetic field or something... eg. pulling air units together and damaging them or something...lol (i got this from my high templar idea long ago...LOL). sounds iffy though....meh...
but we still want a meaty thor blizzard...i mean..cmon!..lol

ohh yeah and i like zeratuls idea of the thors weapons; maybe just let them have 1 type. the electric shock one =] i like that one.

 

gta = ground to air
ata = air to air

is this right?? if so then the possible problem with your suggestion is that wouldnt you think that it is highly unlikely for the thor to maneuver so much to rely on manual targetting measured weapons like laser batteries? it really benefits the thor to have an air splash splash attack since it doesnt overlap with other terran unit roles and even any other unit roles... oh and it doesnt need magnetic disruptors coz theres a big fraction of organic and non metallic aliens out there for the terrans lol.. and also zeratul mentioned about the thor being a goliath replacement, since when was the thor a substitute?? wouldnt you think that it is either wise for it to be able to bombard the skies with its splash atk?? mechas arent only made to be effective for ground, they were more intended to mobilize siege weaponry of either targetting measures (air,ground,marine,space), the point is that blizzard is trying to at least blend its role with versatility, and besides isnt it perfect to be the ultimate terran force?? able to stand against heavy assault, able to defend against air assault, able to siege and bombard enemies at will... and that is something you just get from other terran units as a piece... so its basically a bit of everything that can only be availed if the resources arent scarce...

thor = meattank, ranged air splash(who else has the same attack?), late game tier and quite pricey i suppose...

 

^ ohh sorry..i meant GtG for that laser beams.... and Gta for that magentic thingy...let me correct it...

 

Snipe doesn't work on DS? I am so gonna speed tech Filers to DarkSwarm Terran to death. Oh, hell yes! Seems to me that Terran players will get some stress in TvZ, is it gonna be fast Mutas or fast DS? Too bad the rest of Zerg has been nerfed to hell and beyond. Swarm Guardian also seems kinda gay.

Blizzard can kiss my ass with "the Medivacs work quite well in StarCraft II." Hate the Goliath shoes they've made the Thor put on as well.

 

Remy: How has any of the Zerg been nerfed? Every unit that has been changed has been made more lethal in some way.

--

I like what I am hearing about the Medivac Dropship. It moves fast and heals fast- it'll certainly be a valuable unit on the battlefield.

 

i agree with Remy about the Thor. it is a soaped up version of the Goliath. Just bigger, tankier, and more bad-ass

 

Overlord/Overseer - Instead of making Overseer functionality into universal upgrade(s), the Overseer is an individual evolution. This alone is a fat nerf on Zerg detection. Not only is the Zerg just as vulnerable to supply rushes(the only race that is vulnerable btw), each individual detector is now a greater liability. Yet, the Zerg still doesn't have cloaking capabilities comparable to the other races. The same applies to all Overlords used to being unit transports. Basically, a whole bunch of minuses and no apparent pluses that warrant the change = nerf.

Lurker - Tier 3, unchanged, need I say more? FAT ASS NERF. The Lurker was Zerg's melee backbone from mid-game and on, yet now it's sitting a tier higher with no apparent changes. The Zerg now has no viable way of tech rushing an opponent via cloak(wasn't even true cloak when we could) in time. Yet, we got nerfed to hell on Ovies/detection, yay.

Hydralisk - Hydras are tier 2 now which is also a nerf, but not has big a deal as T3 Lurkers, since Roaches are there to replace them at the corresponding tech tier. Nonetheless, Hydras are sitting a tier higher, with no apparent boost in stats when considering the higher cost and 2 supply.

Mutalisk - Inability to stack is a nerf for the Muta. Mutas arguably need stacking more than any other air unit. However, that's not all. The Corrupter replacing the Devourer indirectly nerfs the Muta. I don't really expect most SC players to understand this or catch it right away, but I will explain. The Mutalisk's secondary bounces deal unusually low damage so many times they will register 0 damage, even against some units with no armor upgrades. However, by ingenious design that is the BW Zerg air, this was overcome by the Devourer's acid spores. The secondary bounces dealt bonus damage equal to the number of acid spores attached to an enemy unit, so the low damage of the secondary bounces became irrelevant(even when they themselves deal 0 damage due to armor). The Mutas were given extended usefulness and functionality by the introduction of the Devourer. As far as I know, Mutas are also largely unchanged, so the removal of Devourers naturally nerf the Mutas, albeit indirectly. The Mutas again are left with largely useless secondary bounces that are by far the worst form of splash damage. Oh, and also, the fact that Corrupter is not an aspect evolved from the Muta is also a minus.

Queen - Completely new unit, recycling the Queen name changes nothing. So no, it isn't an improvement over the SC1 Queen, as this is a completely new unit. The SC2 Queen takes over construction of all Zerg static D. While this may seem like an improvement on the surface, it is in fact a nerf. One of the greatest strengths of Zerg has always been flexibility, the SC2 Queen takes that and flushes it down the toilet. The Zerg is now the only race that have structure that they can not build even if they have workers. The Zerg has always used Drones for building every structure, it has always been that way, and has always been balanced as such. It might be a negative thing on a psychological level, but Zerg has always been fine that way. So while the Queen building mechanic is different, it is not necessary better, as we've been just fine before.

The fact that killing off a single unit means you completely shut down Zerg static D production AND that you enforce the requirement of having to first (re)build a specific unit before you can even start rebuilding defense is a huge and glaring weakness. "As long as you don't let it die" is not a balancing factor, it is stupidity. In scenarios where Zerg barely fends off an assault with most of its base defense wiped out, having a dead Queen means you're now in double the sh!t as you would have been. Now if you throw Ovie hunting into the picture, it's 10 times worse. If you were in "negative supply," you now realize that you can't even make some Drones into replacement static D to free up supply for emergency replacement troops. All of this is made worse by the fact that the Queen must be evolved again every time it dies. So mid- to late-game where you are managing multiple expos, you find yourself already ass raped to the extreme with no Deep Tunnel. Yay, Queen, we love you...

Nydus Worm - While the unit itself is a welcome addition to Zerg's lineup, since for now, it replaces the Overlord as the sole unit transport, it is nerf on Ovies. If it coexisted with the Ovie as unit transports, then it would completely be a good thing, but since that's not the case, it's not entirely good from the Zerg's point of view. For specific reasons you can go read this thread here.

Ultralisk - While it isn't exactly a nerf, I've always thought that the Ultra sucked pretty hard, explained here. I just expected Blizzard to come up with a more creative solution this time, but, of course not. Why anything creative for the Zerg?

Swarm Guardian - Same deal here, Zerg gets no creative juice. While Toss and Terran got amazing changes and additions, we got gay Broodlings. The Guardian is also just as slow as ever based on Jon's testimony.

Zergling - I actually don't know why or how Lings are nerfed. But when I was talking to Jon, he was saying something about Lings not being as effective as before because of how units move now or something like that. I didn't really understand him to be honest, but it didn't sound good at all. Just ask him if you're curious.

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Anyway, I'm not really considering Ultras, Guardians, or Lings as Zerg nerfs, but I am certainly disappointed on the poor effort from Blizzard, they really could've done better. Just seems that Zerg has gotten a lot of crap in line with recycling the Thor as a bastard Goliath, from a creative stand point. If you're really serious about the whole not seeing "any" Zerg nerf, you seriously need to rub your eyes, hard, again, and again, and... yeah you get the point.

EDIT: Just noticed that the part about the Medivac isn't your sig. The Medivac sucks. It is a unit that's supposed to do the job of the Medic at tier THREE. You won't be getting any of that moving fast healing fast business when enemy units are hit-and-running you to death wasting your StimPacked HP. Nor will you be needing any of that moving fast healing fast business at tier 3 when bigger weapons like the Colossi quickly mop up your infantry and cook them into pulp.

 

I agree completly.

The beautiful thing about Zerg was every unit benifitted another, especially the air units.
a swarm of Mutas would tear through a base and due to the continuous bounces of the atacks buildings and units would get a litter weaker, more weaker if the buildings are clustered.
This in turn, protected the Guardian from any AtA since the Mutalisk could engage them and it also softened up the ground units/buildings for the Guardians to easier dispatch of them. Now if the AtA opposition cloaked, bring in the Devourer, not only did it uncloak them with its attack, it also slowed down their attacks with successive hits making it easier for the Mutalisks to kill them, and get into better position for a more effective bounce.
Then when you were unexpectedly outnumbered, enter the Scourge, fast cheap and 120 damage instantly, gets rid of most things.

Now I feel the Zerg are not becoming unified as much, especially in the air as Mutalisks so not benifit from Corruptors as they function as a single group; turning enemy units against them. In no way does that help the Mutalisk complete a task related to the use of its attributes.
Same goes for the Swarm Guardian, it will not get any kind of boost when Mutalisks are around, as opposed to Sc1 as each hit spawns broodlings which in effect does the same as the Mutalisk attack, except with a Interceptor aspect, which suffices for the Guardians slow speed. The Mutalisk wouldn't need any distraction since they were speedy and could stack, don't know about now.

On the Zergling I could bet its because the ''improved'' unit pathing. In Sc1 you could effectivly trap units, thus isolating them to deal the damage. As we all know Zealots will beat Zerglings if it was like 3:1 on every Zealot,the way Zerglings beat Zealots was by having 4 or 5 Zerglings on 1 Zealot which quickly killed it, meaning in those early game, micro-intense moments where all them Zealots are in your base, you have to micro and isolated the Zealots one by one eventually slowing them down to get the correct number of massed units.
Also since the Zerglings are smaller, they will be harder to singlually manage, this was hard enough in Sc1 but now Sc2 it will be even harder to effectivly micro the Zerglings on an intense level.
Also you've seen how units push each other out the way when theres no space, maybe this has been applied to opposing units.

So many amazing things which distinguished the great from medicore are slowly going, such as, when 6 Zealots have just killed your Zerglings and are coming up your tight ramp; you need a way to stop them, what do you do? You send your workers on to the ramp, now how is this possible since the Zealots are in the way? When you click minerals, workers can go through any unit, then while they're all clusted on the ramp you click the ground, thus giving them their space back which makes them all move around trying to get that equal space which is required, and Zealots cannot attack when that happens.

But thinking about it, Terran was the most creative race in Sc1, I think that isn't arguable as you coud do things you wasn't supposed to do such as irridating your Science vessels to kill of organic units, this was formiddable against Zerg when they had no Hydralisks around.
I just think Sc2 lacks those kinda aspects which is what made the game when you come away from the basics.

 

Remy: The only nerf arguments I can even begin to agree on are the Hydralisk, Lurker, and Mutalisk.

The Overseer upgrade is no nerf. Yes, the Zerg no longer get detection in the beginning of the game, but they never needed it in the beginning of the game, either. StarCraft is all about information, knowing things, and that's what the Overseer gives you. Aside from being fast, and providing more control, its passive sight range ability will give the Zerg an incredible ability to safely scout huge areas, making it practically impossible to sneak up on a Zerg player.
The upgrade allows a player to chose between spreading out their supply(control) by building several cheap Overlords, or concentrate it in easier-to-defend-more-useful Overseers. To raid a Zerg player's supply, you first need to be able to sneak up on it... and again, nothing sneaks up on an idle Overseer. You can't do a supply raid on a unit that knows you're coming long before you know where it is.
On cloaking: every Zerg ground unit now burrows. Two of them can move while burrowed, one can attack while burrowed. One of the ones that moves while burrowed can use abilities while burrowed. One of the ones that movies while burrowed, can unburrow and move entire armies across the map with no further effort. Even if the underuse of stealth were a valid argument against a race, it is not one you can apply the SC2 Zerg.

Queen: Take a look at the other side of that statement: the Zerg is the only race that has a structure you can build even if you don't have workers. ...but anyway, that doesn't even matter. unless the player is on the hyper-offensive, they will make a Queen. I think the thing you're having difficulty grasping is that the Queen has to be regarded more as a structure, in terms of tech, and not a unit. It makes a lot more sense if you see it as a tech structure that enables defense. While you are limited to only one, it is almost never the case that a player build several of the same tech structure.
"Not letting it die" is exactly what you'll have to do. It's just like if you want to play without having your income cut off. You have to keep your workers alive, your Hatchery alive. If you want to make static defense, you have to keep your Queen alive. There's nothing special about that, nothing new, nothing unreasonable.