Zerg underpowered

hello,

when i must play against a protoss army, and they have a 4 gateway rush it is impossible to counter it and I always loose...and when you look at the unit protoss and zerg have it's underpowered. ( 1vs1 situation)

do you think ( also in endgame situation ) that the zerg is underpowered.. ?

ofc. u can do a fast rush but is that the only way to win the game oO

 

Zerg is in no way underpowered. The only way I lose to toss is if they go fast void rays or something cheesy. If you scout them, and they have a pylon and 2 gateways on the way, you know they're doing some type of zealot/stalker build. And it just so happens that speedlings counter stalkers and roaches counter zealots. Once I scout them doing a multi-gate push, I just use my general 14 pool/15 hatch, throw down two spine crawlers and get a few roaches and I can hold off that first push. After that, its all about having the better economy. Harrass with speedlings, mow down zealots with roaches, tech to hydras...if you've got hydras and roaches and he's still pumping out zealots and stalkers from one base, its gg

 

What build orders have you been using? What mix of units has the player been sending to attack you? What mix of units have you been using to counter? Did it ever occur to you that you may not be as skilled with Zerg as you think you are?



[ot]I am really not looking forward to ten years of threads like this.[/ot]

 

Zerg units are not unpowered. Protoss are strong early game tho so it can make it difficult. Make sure you make good use of your zerglings and always get a good surround with them.

 

Shhhh the truth hurts

 

No guys, hes right. Zerg are underpowered and it is completely impossible to win a game against a 4 gate protoss player (the great many people who have done this before were all just flukes, so they don't count)

Therefore I suggest waiting for the patch where they make zerg start the game off with 10 brood lords because otherwise you are out of luck vs protoss.

 

If both you and your opponent just throw your forces right at each other, Zerg often don't stand a chance against either T or P, sure. But using creep you can get some really nice surrounds. It's about catching them out of position.
With the help of Creep Tumors, Overlords and Overseers spawning Changelings, Zerg can have vision of a majority of the map. Use that info to mostly avoid his main army until a good surround or such shows itself.

Usually a Protoss will keep 90 % of his forces at the same place. A protoss with 3 bases or more will have a hard time protecting them all if you use the creep speed bonus to bounce around and take out the Nexuses he doesn't have time to protect.

 

While I certainly agree with you that harrassing against protoss is a must due to their lack of anything close to speed of speedlings, I still think zerg can go straight up with toss and terran. Roaches and hydras steamroll any toss ground force, and corruptors do pretty well in the air. Throw in an infestor or two to fungal zealots and the advantage is even further in your favor. Some toss player went for an all-in with carriers and stalkers, and my 60 hydras tore them to shreds. I don't think zerg players HAVE to use flanking and surprise attacks to win, but its certainly an advantage we have over other races

 

IMO Zerg can be tough for toss. You can win all the early battles you want as toss, but you're not getting past 4 spine crawlers and roaches no matter how many immortals/stalkers/zealots you have... then hydras pop and the zerg force is hard to counter... high templar suck vs roaches, and hydras kill everything very quickly, and a flood of lings gets a surround after you've already engaged the roaches.

 

Still, you guys are all ignoring the fact that a couple immortals with some zealots to soak up damage, do extremely well against roaches. Higher level players who spot you going for mass roaches really won't keep building mostly zealots and stalkers. A couple sentries and immortals will rape you if you don't snipe them off quickly.

 

"Still, you guys are all ignoring the fact that a couple immortals with some zealots to soak up damage, do extremely well against roaches."

Banshees also tend to do extremely well vs roaches. You cannot count on one unit to be good against everything. Zealots and Immortals are made to beat up on a mass roach army by design.

"Higher level players who spot you going for mass roaches really won't keep building mostly zealots and stalkers."

Which is normal, they transitioned and so should you. Higher level zerg players will not continually pump out a unit that is not tailored to fight what the other player is making.

 

You just basically copied what I said, but said it a little different... What's your point with that post, if I may ask? Mine was that using hard counters doesn't automatically win you the game. :/

Anyways, I've been on this forum, and several others, for years now. I've seen dozens of these single unit targeted threads over the years, so I'm not even going to bother with a yet another elaborate reply anymore to these.

 

Well you brought up how roaches are weak against their counter, so I thought it was just QQ or something (since the thread was titled "zerg underpowered") so my apologies if that wasn't the case

 

Not really. Quite happy with the current balance around roaches, actually. It's the overpoweredness (is that a word?) of properly used infestors that concerns me. ^^

 

When I see a four gate coming:

a)fortify expansions/hatcheries with spine crawlers, accompanied with queens and zerglings- I tend to go for the boom, so I'm already prepared with creep laid by my queens and the pumped out zerglings. You can heal using your Queen's Transfusion, so be sure to stay recessed behind your spine crawlers.

b)try to take out their expansions- If you survive the first harass you should have a favorable economic advantage, try to capitalize even more by slowing their expansions. I also like to lay overlords near expansions and dump creep, of course you have to have a lair already built, but by this point hopefully you are already strengthening a roach/hydralisk army. Be wary of roaches if they are going hard Immortals (since they do extra dmg to hvy armor).

Anyway, it's not that Zerg are underpowered, you're just making comparisons of units and that's only one piece of the puzzle. Try expanding your knowledge of the game strategies and tactics, and understand that zerg units may melt, but they also pump out quickly and have other tools to use for the fight. Having said that you still have to keep up with upgrades. If you allow your opponent to upgrade weapons and you're behind on your carapace it's not going to look very good.

 

4 gates push is hard but not impossible build spine crawlers build an evo chamber infront of them if u have to and try to tech to hydras (while still defending with lings

most mediocre protoss players do a 4 gate into void rays hydras will take care of all of that and it takes atleast 4 gas to get collosi/ht's which beat hydras (even if he gets a few just get a couple mutas) so you should make sure he doesnt expand, after that u win, congrats now u can beat every mediocre protoss player in the world

 

roaches with speed can kite zealots sooo easily, and roach with hydra backup works pretty solidly against gate units.
zergling + roach works well against massed stalker with no zealot/sentry support. speedlings don't give a damn how far they blink, they catch up.

 

By the time your roaches have the speed upgrade, your protoss opponent will at the very least be researching zealot charge, so the speed upgrade won't make your units last much longer. Although while fighting on creep you will still have your advantage, obviously. The problem is that spreading creep all over the map can be a problem against protoss, since their armies almost always have observers with them. This makes destroying the creep tumors extremely easy for any protoss player.

 

What build are you actually trying to do? Me i go for a 9 pool followed by a roach den then baneling nest. Roaches Zerglings and a few banelings and get 2 queens from your first base before you even think of expanding. 1 to spawn larva the other to move your creep to where you are expanding too. That way you can move your spine crawlers up before your second base pops out, and once it does you already have a queen to support it. Usually by the time i get my second base out i have already dropped my spire. With your main army at my front door and just say 4 Mutas you can pretty much hold them off and start your own harrassment. You just have to be good on your micro and your macro for this type of setup. Ive even seen someone hold it off with spinecrawlers behind evo chambers after a 14 pool but imo that leaves your open early to a 2 Zealot rush. Basicly bro you just need to know whats coming and counter accordingly. also tucking your banelings off away from your roach ling army is a good idea as well. Most toss players going for a 4 gate dont put up many photon cannons and if you can get mutas on the field you can really cripple him.

 

I am sick of hearing you people arugeing about that zerg are underpowered....They are NOT underpowered...ZERG is based on 100% MACRO/MICRO control...If you dont know how to macro good = you lose, if you dont know how to micro good = you lose...Protoss doesn´t have queens that needs to inject larva every 40th second and creep every 30 second so ofcourse its EASIER to play as protoss or even terran but zerg is sooo much different then the other races that way. This is a advice for all zerg players, if your opponent got 2 exps and you got 2 exps its less chance you win, zerg ALWAYS has to stay ontop with the minerals and gas, i always make a hatch at 15 supplyes and pool at 14 and i dont lose, i just prevent him from taking an exp and always scout him, if he is going for void then just get up some extra queens and you will be fine. Queens are excellent of killing air units as long as it isn´t to many..2 queens take out 2 void´s. Keep that in mind.