I've been a zerg player since I started playing SC1 and I definitely enjoy their style. I played Gold league in beta when it was the next to highest league. I haven't done my placement matches since release yet because I'm re-evaluating my choice of race. As a zerg player, my APM normally hovered around 60APM which led me to a very positive league record (over 2:1 wins:losses) but, never-the-less, I always saw many things in the replay that 'oh, if I was faster, I could have done that' and, as the game went on and there was more and more to do, this problem compounded itself. Normally I am an aggressive player so most of my games were over in under 15 minutes before it could be a big problem but I still saw untapped potential. Well, after watching many replays I decided to give protoss a try. I had never really played with them but I did see potential and, while I don't believe they are quite as versatile as zerg, I felt I might be more successful because it seemed like they required a lower APM for the same level of success. Right now I am pounding away, trying to figure out protoss a little better before I play my placement matches but I feel strongly that they will become my new race. My APM as protoss are generally lower (45-50) which, at least in part, is because I haven't played nearly as many games with them and don't know the keys as well. But, here is the catch. I played ~10 games against Very Hard, random Computers as Zerg and I lost all of those games. Switching to protoss, I have had a few close calls but I have won almost every, if not every, match. So that is my very long winded explanation of why I feel the design of zerg is, at this time, too micro intensive. What does everyone else think, am I off my rocker?
zerg do require a little higher apm but its mostly because of the queen there needs to be a setting so that she will auto spawn larva
Also auto call-down of mules and chronoboost on every production building producing something. Dont be stupid. Zerg is generally a fast race, which often have more expansions than the others, and so on. But they need less watching over than Terran, and Protoss´s units need more micro to get to their full potential. It depends on playstyle, but the hardcore Macro of Zerg can feel more intensive than the other races.
I think Zerg also require a lot more thinking ahead / reaction than some of the other races. Since we melt so quickly you really have to pay attention to what units you're counter / being countered with, and you have to be pretty flexible with transitioning into other units depending on how your opponent goes. That's why scouting is so crucial!
Zerg does require a lot of flanking/proper unit usage, but it doesn't necessarily result in a higher APM. With Toss I'm usually around 70-90 APM depending on the strat I'm using. I mean, I micro improperly once and my whole army is dead and I lose.
I've always felt Zerg at least FEEL like they require more micro because they: 1) Tend to produce more units (and more units means more individual things to micro); and, 2) Tend to have weaker units HP wise (and that means you have to be faster to save/recycle injured units). If you look at it on a very small scale, who has the easier micro job, the guy with 4 lings or the guy with 1 zealot?
What bovineblitz said about miss-microing an army is true. If you do, you lose. But I guess I feel like each race's army micro is similar (although protoss may indeed be a little heavier) but zerg's macro game is more micro intensive (if that even makes sense). That is how I felt at first, though I am starting to rethink that slightly. As zerg, if you spawn larva and then forget to create units because of the battle, the larva are stockpiled and you can build them later. But as protoss, if you don't build another set of units when the warpgates are ready, then you have lost that time because you can't stockpile warp-ins. I haven't gotten into any really long games as protoss yet so I haven't found that to be a big problem but I can see the potential problem. Protoss units (compared to zerg) definitely do have more abilities which makes microing during fights more of a concern. But, several of those can be what forces your opponent to have good micro as well (IE moving out of storms, avoiding forcefields, picking off phoenix, etc) Maybe it is just because I am more experienced with zerg that I feel this way. When I found myself playing protoss, I wasn't near as active scouting or placing units around the map, controlling the towers, or (obviously) spreading creep. As zerg I have a list of about 20 things that I always need to be doing and maybe that list exists for protoss, I'm just not quite as aware of it. Anyway, my decision has been to play my placement matches as zerg, my normal race, and then play as both zerg and protoss from there and see which develops into my stronger race. Whether one is more micro intensive or not isn't the big issue I guess, its which can you play better.
I don't think the queen needs autospawn, but when I play zerg I put all my queens on the same hotkey and then I push inject larva and then click where my hatchery is on the minimap, It would be nice if I just had to push Inject and it and any queen automaticly injects near whichever hatchery she is closest too if there is enough mana available.
i think spawn larva needs to be autocast. it's a spell that you want to use constantly anyways, and there's really only one target for any queen to use it on, unlike chrono boost or MULEs... it would help the player concentrate more on the overall strategy instead of going back to his base and clicking spawn larva a dozen times.
The cool thing about zerg APM though is that by late game it is focused so much on units and easier production while other races have to spend more APM on macro. My reasoning for this is that zerg have to build 1 building to open up production at all the hatcheries, so the early and mid game is spent acquiring these structures while the late game is often sending in your chosen mix while you hotkey your hatcheries to make sure you keep producing what is best. Protoss need to go back to the pylon for their warp and back to their buildings for robo. Also, if they want more of anything they have to have more buildings. Terran are in a similar situation, only a little bit more so since they can't warp they have to go to their buildings. So, yeah I agree that zerg early and midgame APM has to be a bit higher but the late game payoff is so nice when you can just hatch a fresh army when you need it without dealing with each structure, only hatcheries
Yeah, once you have all the necessary tech you need, you can pretty much just play the game from the minimap with control groups. All hatcheries are grouped so you can make an army instantly, you don't even need to spend 10 seconds or so fooling around with worker buildings to get more supply, just make some overlords. Queens can also be grouped together, and you can spawn larva by clicking directly on the minimap location of your hatchery, so it should only take you about 2 seconds each time. Then just control group your army and send it around via minimap, taking out enemy expos, defending your own, and setting up flanks when the opponent tries to push out.
I don't know that it should be autocast. Using it rewards players who are strong microers. It is another (small) thing that separates the diamond from the platinum or something like that. Just like using chrono boost rewards a player capable and conscious of micro activities. Terran's MULEs on the other hand seem to be a little less vital just because, as long as energy isn't maxed, you haven't lost much (minerals now versus minerals later... important yes, but not quite as important as lost units. Maybe this importance depends on which stage of the game you are in?)
^^ This Even during encounters, sometimes I'm so preoccupied with macro, that i don't get a chance to micro those units. Good thing Zerg(in most cases) requires the least amount of micro.
Terran isn't in the same situation, they can just hotkey their buildings. With toss you need to have your screen on a pylon to warp stuff in, which KILLS your micro. In a lenghty micro battle, you can't just hit 5+zzzzzzzzz to make 8 zealots, you have to focus your screen elsewhere and sacrifice micro in order to keep your production up to par. Warp gates are a blessing and a curse.
Haven't visited the forums in a while, dropped by to give my 2 cents. Spawning larvae should never be able to auto cast, and same for many other things, because these are ONE of the mechanics that differentiate between good and bad players. Also, spawn larvae is not always the best option as you get into early mid game, you need to put down creep tumors, especially with the second queen spawning at the expansion to bridge the gap between the two. Also when a 4 gate push comes, you need energy for transfusion, so if you did have auto cast spawn larvae, you would have no energy, too much larvae, and lost more than you should. Back to the main topic, yes zerg is macro and micro intensive, because every unit is so important, losing a few makes a huge difference in a large fight due to them running off or dying, or you not keeping up with harass at multiple places. Out of all the races, zerg ranks second highest in APM requirement, where terran takes first. You need well over 100 APM to command zerg even remotely effectively in high level play, which is why we don't see that many DECENT zerg players right now in the american community. So do not fret for your bad performance with zerg with only 40-50APM, it will only get better as you play more. Zerg is also vastly unique and different from the other two races, making it most difficult for most new players to understand the how zerg is really played in SC2.
but having auto spawn an right click ability like the auto repair on SCVs would be nice. i.e. late game, I could decide to turn it on, but early game, I could save it if need be. question, WTF does APM mean?
APM is actions per minute, which is considered a limiting factor to a person's skill level to many, but does not prove skill. Once APM reaches about 100 on average, it doesn't really matter as much in terms of skill levels. However you can see big differences in skill every 20 APM increment up to 100ish To answer you're first question, the main reason probably why blizzard didn't implement it, was due to competitive reasons. In the beta, you could highlight all your queen / hatch, and just spawn larva on the portrait without going back into the base. They took that away shortly after the beta ended, due to it's convenience(same for chrono boost), so the game would take slightly more skill and experience for higher level play. It is truly unfortunate that lower level players don't have these "auto" options, but that's how it is. Hope I answered your question thoroughly.
