unique mechanics for the 3 races

there are some mechanics in starcraft1 that are basically the same for each race, an example being resource gathering, Anubis_theDark has created an excellent thread with ideas on the Resource gathering system. go check it out.

another aspect that could use improvement is the supply system. while the zerg overlord is very unique, the supply depot and the pylon are too similar in practice. it's true that the core concept of pylon is quite different from the supply depot in that:

1. the pylon supplies power within a radius and dictates where protoss buildings can be built.
2. destroying a pylon would render buildings in its area powerless.

however in practice the potential of these differences are not fully realized:

1. because starcraft has a large unit limit, many pylons are needed to reach maximum supply, but only a few pylons are needed to cover a base with psi-field, so the psi field is only useful for the first few pylons, other pylons are just packed in regular rows and columns like terran player build their supply depots. making them the same as supply depots

2. because there are so many pylons in a typical protoss base, each building is usually powered by multiple pylons, this renders the "taking out pylon first" tactic virtually useless. it's clear that blizzard are quite fond of this "taking out pylon first" tactic, as shown in quite a few places such as in the stargate lore and in the banshee clip:

http://starcraft2.com/flash/global/movieplayer_terran_banshee.swf

but in reality in most situations targeting pylons first is not a wise tactic, due to the sheer number of them. the pylon also had 3 times the combined hp and shield of a photon cannon. so by the time you've taken out a pylon, you could have destroyed 3 photon cannons, and receiving less damage in the process as the cannons are likely to die one by one meaning you are not under fire from all 3 cannons during the whole time, possibly making less of your units die, which will in turn destroy the cannons faster. costing 450 mineral, the cannons are also more expensive for the enemy to replace, where as the pylon only cost 100 minerals.

a way to fix this problem of too many pylons built only for supply and not for psi-field is to reduce the number of pylons required. we can make each pylon supply more food but this would mean each pylon would also need to cost more, which is a bad idea as it'll dramatically slow down the first gateway. therefore, i've come up with the idea of pylon upgrades. basically a level 1 pylon would be the same as the old pylon except it will only have 200/200 hp instead of 300/300. however each pylon can be upgraded individually to a maximum of level 5. each upgrade provides the following:

- increase supply by 8 (or whatever base amount)
- increase radius of psi-field by 1 (using the unit that measures range)
- increase production speed of all buildings within psi-field by 5% (does not stack with other pylons)
- increase shield by 50% of base amount (so 100 per level with my example)
- cost 50% of original
- time needed to upgrade is the same as time needed to build a level 1 pylon, provides no power while upgrading.

here's a summary

Level Hp/shield Radius Supply Cost
1 200/200 6 8 100
2 200/300 7 16 150
3 200/400 8 24 200
4 200/500 9 32 250
5 200/600 10 40 300

this way just a handful of fully upgraded pylons are needed reach maximum supply, removing the problem of too many redundant pylons.

the decision to upgrade pylons would add an extra layer to protoss strategic decision making. while high level pylon provide more supply per mineral cost, they are very fragile in terms of hp and are easily destroyed, and losing a high level pylon would be a big set back. this would also make targeting pylon first a valid tactic and make the psi-field mechanic more significant. also because upgrading a pylon cuts its power, backup pylons will be needed if a player decides to upgrade, this further increases the upgrading dilemma, and in turn enhances the importance of the decision to upgrade.

i've suggested the bonus increase in the rate of production with each upgrade to somewhat balance out the terran nuclear reactor a bit. i'm expecting the zerg to get even faster unit production mechanic to enable better swarming. so this would be the protoss unique mechanic for faster production. a level 5 pylon would provide a 20% increase in production rate to potentially many buildings. (6 units in the time of 5) this seems reasonable for an expensive, slow to build and vulnerable structure.

lol i've talked about pylons all this time...

back to the topic of this thread, which is unique mechanics to separate the races for things that are currently too similar, things like resource gathering, and interesting mechanics in general. please post your own interesting ideas.

 

but, if the person had one pylon near his nexus, he could power the entire base with it and that sucks ass

 

why would that suck ass? if he only has one pylon in his entire base then that pylon would clearly be the vulnerable point. you could destroy it and the entire base would lose power.

 

Thus the reason almost nobody has ever done such a stupid idea.

 

well it depends on the player, if he decides to save money by not building back up pylons than he run the risk of enemy focusing on the pylon, the up side is saving money, it adds strategic decision

 

great idea.

but the cost is to cheap for each upgrade. coz having cheap upgrades will not prevent you from making more pylons. you will still get redundant pylons everywhere just to be safe if the upgrade cost are cheap.

it should be like
lvl 1 100
lvl 2 200
lvl 3 300
lvl 4 400
lvl 5 500

and to prevent from massing lvl 1 pylons. i say their HP should be nerf down a lot.

lvl 1 50 hp 100 shield
lvl 2 150 hp 200 shield
lvl 3 200 hp 300 shield
lvl 4 250 hp 350 shield
lvl 5 300 hp 400 shield

 

The problem with altering resource gathering systems is that resource gathering is such an important aspect of the game that messing with it without ending up in imba is really hard. I think it is fine as it is now. Also the terran mechanic of selling the buildings is a way to alter the collection of resources, in a way.

About the pylons.. well I they are just supposed to be there. Leveling them un and things like that would make gameplay a real mess for the protoss. But your idea is not bad at all. It might actually work.

 

actually making upgrades cheap will encourage players to upgrade existing pylons instead of building new ones, thus reducing the number pylons. making the upgrade cost the same as the initial pylons would not give enough benefits to upgrade, you would just build another one.

also 50hp/100shield is too low for a building, it's better to start higher and make upgrade give less. the main purpose of the upgrade is to increase supply at lower cost, not making the pylon tougher. because the small increase in hp/shield an upgraded pylon is more vulnerable than 2 un-upgraded ones. that's the choice you have to make

 

How did you download that banshee video?

 

I don't know. This is a little too much. Uniqueness is good, but too much can upset the balance.

 

check it out yourself by quoting


http://starcraft2.com/flash/global/movieplayer_terran_banshee.swf

 

I don't get your post.

 

if you quote my previous post then the code will be shown in the quick reply screen

 

Ah I get it now. Thanks :good:

http://starcraft2.com/flash/global/movieplayer_terran_banshee.swf

And how did you find out the URL of the flash file?

 

search starcraft2.com for swf files

 

How to do that?

 

I like the pylon-level idea, I've thought of it myself, and I am sure it would work, but it isn't really a StarCraft-ish mechanic. I know levels are done with larger structures through upgrades, Zerg structures do too, but they do it to open up new abilities, not a linear stacking of the basic ability. Again, it is a solid mechanic, it's used all over the place in Supreme Commander (the highest-level shield generators are absolutely insane) but it doesn't fit, if just barely, with StarCraft's style.

 

Well I'm thinking, on a similar note, that a depot can be upgraded, sacrificing their supply giving abilities, in exchange for a massive boost to armor and health.

 

type "starcraft2.com/*.swf" in google

 

My suggestion:

Combine the shield battery and the pylon into one building, maybe as an upgrade