TvP - What after initial M/M push?

Discussion in 'StarCraft 2 Strategy Discussion' started by terran.gangster, May 7, 2010.

TvP - What after initial M/M push?

  1. I'm not too good of a player and new... top 20 in bronze league. Anyway I usually start out with 2 barax, then add ghost academy, factory + another rax soon (for 3 rax total) eventually. I pump out marines/marauders (2 tech labs) and ~1-2 ghosts and then make an initial attack. 80% of the time in my league I face a mix of zealots/stalkers, and am able to either beat the army (and win the game) or else barely beat the army or tie. I usually simultaneously expand with this first push.

    My question is, in the situation where I barely beat or tie versus their army in the first push, what should I tech towards? I'm talking about a typical protoss strategy where they have zeal/stalker and upgrade to include immortals. Should I focus more on getting a decent amount of seige tanks, or else should I push towards faster stimpacks + medivacs + engineering bay? Or hybrid of both (which i figure is less effective than aggressively going for one or the other strategy)? I find that during this first push I tend to stack up on a lot of resources, even while continually pumping out MM.
     
  2. I still don't know what to do against void rays. :/
     
  3. Yorkylol

    Yorkylol New Member

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    Hi, I am a current Protoss player fairly new to the game, but I can tell you T forces have always been trouble for me primarily because Zealots are weak as hell, but thats besides the point, try pushing in some Reapers, to destroy Protoss econ, basically without a constant flow of Minerals the Protoss will fall, everything costs so much to build with the Protoss, so we need out resources. Early game use Reapers to just harass our workers and knock that out of the way, and use a constant push of forces through the front. You could also after the first Reaper attack send another and once that reaches destination, throw your units through the front, chances are some of his units are attacking at the Reapers, and you might have better luck pushing through.

    Reaper rushes on my econ have been my biggest struggle from the start, but im starting to adjust to them.


    Void rays are fairly weak, using AA is an easy way to counter them, but not while they are in their second attack form, you could have more units going against them and they will still prevail, but if they are not in that second attack phase you could probably come out of the battle alive with just as many or a few less units than the opposing Void Rays.

    Also if you are playing T, those Turret Silos are great defense against Void Rays, but as I said before, once they are in that second attack phase its over.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 8, 2010
  4. MeisterX

    MeisterX Hyperion

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    Need to start pushing a double factory tech with infantry support. Go with one factory (or two later game) pushing Hellions w/ Light damage upgrade versus the Zealots and Siege Tanks out of 2 (or 3 late game) Factories.

    You then have to support this with a mix of Vikings/Dropship/Marines/Marauder.

    This is a very hard mix for Protoss to stop.

    Use the Hellions as a meat shield between your tanks and the Protoss army. They tear Zealots to shreds and are otherwise used for keeping Stalkers and Immortals at a distance where your tanks can rock their socks.

    Mixing in Ghost/Marine/Viking/Dropship/Thor will let you beat his air units mid-game (you'll need mass Battlecruiser + Viking against Carriers) and the Ghost's EMP will help devastate Immortals and Stalkers. As you tech to Tier 3 you can add in the Raven before moving to Battlecruisers.

    If you play this mid-game mech push correclty you'll most likely win as it's difficult for Protoss to stop.

    You can skip the Marines/Ghosts/Vikings if he's not going air.

    EDIT: As far as specifically fighting Void Rays, you want to pump Marines w/ Medivac and shield upgrade, this will eventually overpower the Void Rays. You can also use Vikings but they will lose in a 1:1 fight with Void Rays. But you can win with micro. Every time a Void Ray charges up on a Viking (or any other unit) run it away from the Void Ray's range. This will cause the Void Ray to reset its attack making it do less damage overall.

    If you do it right you can essentially cancel out any damage the Void Ray does to 0.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2010
  5. cautionmike_190

    cautionmike_190 New Member

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    whew void ray???, just marines and viking will do >_<
     
  6. EonMaster

    EonMaster Eeveelution Master

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    the counters to void ray really only work if they are in phase 1 attack or there are a few of them. Avoid fighting them when they are in phase 2 unless its necessary.

    Also, the BC yamato 1 shots a void ray, so having a few storing energy wouldn't hurt.
     
  7. cautionmike_190

    cautionmike_190 New Member

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    well, void ray in such way sometimes hurts
     
  8. KHaYMaN

    KHaYMaN New Member

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    I don't play terran yet, so I have to ask you guys:

    How do ghosts with emp + their aimed/steady/sniper shot (can't remember what it is called) measure up against void rays?
     
  9. EonMaster

    EonMaster Eeveelution Master

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    Haven't tried ghosts, though I believe Snipe only works on biological units. EMP drops shields by 100, so it would be useful to try and eat the shield to deal damage to the HP before they run away.
     
  10. Subversion

    Subversion New Member

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    ghost emp is good against all things protoss.

    need them as a backup tho, not a main army
     
  11. Smipims

    Smipims Guest

    As someone who's been trying protoss a lot try this against void rays: mass marines.

    Marines are cheap and tear up void rays right quick. If you know where the void rays are coming from, you can unload on them before they charge up all the way. That's the key to countering them imo: if you know where they're coming from, you can do a lot of damage when they can't do a lot of damage back.
     
  12. Fslb

    Fslb New Member

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    Stim-packing marines are a great addition to any terran army. The more the merrier (assuming you're not food capped). Marines in huge numbers deal exceptional dmg after a ghost EMP. EMP, stimpack. and you will probably force many toss players to fall back if not eliminating all their forces.
     
  13. Mimic

    Mimic New Member

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    you should tech. so either go 1 factory with TL and a starport with a Reactor or double factory. so keep making marauders adn marines but now add tanks and medivacs or just a ****load of tanks. also makes sure you have stim with the medivacs becaus eit increases your damage output by alot. so gl try it out.
     
  14. Taerix

    Taerix New Member

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    I'd say keep going with what's working. Your ability to adapt quickly will be what wins you the game. If he starts making a ton of Colossi, then you should go more marauders and vikings, if he then switches to immortals, make marines and get a few ghosts.

    There's so many different strategies you can do, plus everything depends on the situation and what your opponent is producing. The MMM Ball is always a great way to start it off though.
     
  15. toochaos

    toochaos New Member

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    btw they dont reset if they change targets within about 2 seconds, which is what makes them so dam powerful, with the speed upgrade they can chase down any terran air.

    with terran i personally like a vikings, and the invis ship with rockets whose name i cannt recall, then some BCs. vikings make good ground units to kill bases too, dont forget it.
     
  16. cHowziLLa

    cHowziLLa New Member

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    i disagree with a lot of the replies... tanks are very good against protoss because their air units aren't very good (unless they go carriers, but unlikely)
    Thors are a good choice also.

    however in a pure ground to group battle, MMM with ghosts EMP, i think T should win, the only thing to be careful of is psy-storm and colossi. if u have the feeling he is going void raids early game, make a lot of marines