Robotics facility vs twilight council

Discussion in 'Protoss' started by Nem, Aug 11, 2010.

Robotics facility vs twilight council

Discussion in 'Protoss' started by Nem, Aug 11, 2010.

  1. Nem

    Nem New Member

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    so lets say that from the start I decide to go with a 4 gate build, I get my units out, ive massed alot of stalkers and zealots, now somewhere between 5-10minutes I guess Im going to be relying on these gateway units quite a bit because ive already invested into 4 gates + warpgate for this build

    so given the amount of ground units I have, it would make sense to get the charge and blink abilities research which means I have to get a twilight council

    however, against any army I would need to have eyes on my opponent so I would like to get an observer out which requires a robotics

    so my question is, in these early stages of the game, should I be going for a robotics to get vision? or a twilight council for upgrades to what will make up the bulk of my force later on? how do you decide which building to get first?
    Im usually too scared to get both so early because it sucks up resources that I would otherwise need to put into an actual army to hold back rushes against me
     
  2. Endroil

    Endroil New Member

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    Depends.

    I had this really, REALLY long reply to this featuring a story about my recent game and my identical dilemma, but I'm going to have to say that simply, every game is a little bit of a gamble. You go for one thing, sometimes you're just going to be outlucked, the enemy got a counter for it up his sleeve. But you can do your best to find out what he has - remember you don't always REQUIRE observers.

    REMEMBER - You can scout with other units, not only observers. For example, Zealots. Losing one is not that big of a deal, the information you can get is well worth 100 minerals.
    WALL OF TEXT BELOW - FEATURING TIPS ETC. CONSIDERING WHEN TO BUILD ONE OR ANOTHER OF THE BUILDINGS AND HOW TO PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT HE'S DOING AND ALL THAT CRAP. FOR A SWIFT REPLY TO YOUR QUESTION WITHOUT WALL OF TEXT, READ QUOTED PART ONLY->
    -> "It depends on the situation. Scout alot. Pay attention to what he's doing. Adapt."

    If your opponent is Protoss, you might be able to sneak into his base. And even if you can't, you can more often than not get a decent preview of it, leting you know if the opponent has Zealots or Stalkers. Is he perhaps teching air? Pay attention to the size of his army. What can you expect? Keep in mind what he knows about you, what is he likely to go for? It's mindgames.

    If your opponent is Terran, he will more often than not have blocked his base already - It's practically impossible to get inside. This may make it a bit more tricky, so you might want to get Observers early to be able to sneak in and get a real look at what he's doing. However, run up with a Zealot and pay attention to his army. Does he have tanks nuking at you? (He can have them hidden though, obviously) - get Immortals. Does he have a huge army of Marines & Marauders? Get High Templars and tech Psionic Storm. If you have alot of Zealots, you might want to act before he gets air if he knows about your Zealots, or if you suspect he's teching them. Pump out High Templars swiftly and tech charge - your Zealots will eat Marines & marauders alive this way. While you micro your invasion, macro your base to get ready for some anti-air if that is what he's going. If he gets them out in time, he will be able to kill your army, but hopefully you will have made a huge amount of damage on his base by then.

    If your opponent is Zerg, It will usually be very easy to get into the base and scout around. If a Probe cant do it, go with a Zealot.
    Zealots with Charge and High Templars beats alot of Zerg strats, however banelings can vaporize your army almost instantly so if you're building them, keep CLOSE attention to what he's geting. If It's just Roaches, Hydralisks and Zerglings - you'll be fine.
    Mutalisks are a bit more tricky. I'm sure, however, you already know what kind of Protoss Units can fight air etc. - so I'm not going to talk about it, but remember the Zerg base is often very easy to get in to, so just rush up with a Zealot and scout out what he's doing - and you'll hopefully detect that Spire in good time. It takes alot of time to build, but once It's up - there will be alot of Mutalisks spawning at once!

    PS: I'd say if you've no idea what he's going, you should probably try to get a Robotics Facility out - without any information throughout the entire game, you run a very slim chance of winning. With no information, you might want to run otherwise adaptable strategies. Get some early Zealots in case of a Rush, and then some stalkers, incase of an airborne attack. Etc. - no fishy stuff. You need information ASAP.
     
  3. snowden0908

    snowden0908 New Member

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    In a more simple and less interesting response...

    Twilight Council units, though effective, have limited uses. If you scout and know for sure that they can be used in the game then there is no harm in getting them.

    Robotics Facility units though have more varied uses but in some cases are slightly less effective. If you don't know what route your opponent is going though, this is a good way to go.

    Also, consider whether or not you can do enough damage before the other player transitions. For example if you find a terran going bio ball then you can get high templars to counter but it does you no good if the terran then transitions to banshees and wrecks you. Make sure to take advantage of those units or else the templars are not going to be worth much.
     
  4. mystery_NL

    mystery_NL New Member

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    My best tip: and one which is not used enough!!
    Hallucination! The sentry unit can use it to become a phoenix or even a colossus! And so also gain the moving abillities of that unit. So what I suggest is that you play your game the way you want to and if you want to scan make the hallucination of 2/3 colossi. Your opponent will think you have build that unit you hallucinated and is giving (hopefully) a good counter to that hallucination. Which will suggest in a perfect counter for you and a nice scan as well!

    Edit: Just won a game like that. Researched the hallucination, went for 2 colossi, he countered with air units and my void rays killed it like it was nothing :) match won!
     
  5. DREAD

    DREAD New Member

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    Interesting suggestion, i have yet to utilize the hallucination of the sentry, always using FF or Barrier, will have to try this method, especially for scouting