Protoss needs some sort of revamp

Ok, this may be me, but I think protoss units, structures, and general mechanics need to be revamped and changed.

1) Graphics are much less pretty compared to terran. Though this is probably going to be changed in beta, thought I point out that terran are really looking nicein the unit detail. Protoss lack this new graphical feel.

2) Tier/buildings waaaaayyyy too similar. I mean, terran are veerrrrryyy different. Their new units totally change the terran playstyle. While I don't think protoss should be so novel, as of now, they aren't much different from the protoss in sc1. Sure we don't have reaver drops anymore and we have a new warp-in, but that isn't much of a difference. Compared to terran who can't go heavy mech anymore (which was the main strategy for like every T V P matchup), this change is minimal. Therefore, the buildings need to be changed to really make protoss feel different.

3) New mechanics. NOT new abilities. I'm fine with the abilities and the units as of now. Pretty nice. However, I'm angry with the lack of new racial mechanics. Terran have a lot of new ones: towers that show enemies as exclamation marks, a floating starbase, salvage...as well as old ones: floating buildings, many units able to switch abilities on and off...

Protoss have their old warp-in buildings and now warp-in units. They also have the phase cannon warp which is nice. that's pretty much it. They really new to be revamped to balance them out as well as add new mechanics to make them a very new race with some similar characteristics. I mean, playing terran makes you feel different. No more vultures and tanks, you can get ghosts mid-tier now...Protoss seems the same: zealots to stalkers, choose a tech tree, build high tech units and upgrade and attack. That's like the exact same. Yes, there are new units in the higher tech, but you still drop, you still mass and attack....I think this is way too similar.


overall, I believe protoss deserve a revamp or at least a review to add new mechanics and delete things (for balance) to allow old players a new feel when sitting down to play protoss.

 

I dunno, they look pretty sweet to me. Still, the game is sill in it's somewhat early stages. They need to balance everything, get a set roster of units, then they can polish things up

Lore-wise, this makes perfect sense. The Protoss have been doing things the same way for ages. Terrans are the new kids on the block and much more flexible. You can see the Dark Templar influence, and it's slowly melding, but it's gonna take a while.

While the Warp Gate and the new cannon are the only new things we've seen, we know almost nothing about Protoss structures at the moment.

How different can you make that? Having a lack of units/abilities at certain tiers compared to other races neuters the lacking race. Balance is number one, then uniqueness.

They'll get worked over countless times before the game releases.

 

1. I agree that the graphics for protoss aren't looking as finished as the terrans atm, i think the stalker and immortal need alot more work.

2. terran was probably revamped a lot more because in sc1 everyone played terran the same, offensive spidermining and then siege tanks. Whereas protoss had much more diversity mid game, DT, corsairs, HT and reaver.

3. What other mechanics do protoss need?

 

i dont think the protoss have to change more, they are very different from the other races now, so they don't need more uniqness or mechanics(altough it would be fun)

 

while protoss graphics will be worked over for sure
ild suggest u just wait a little bit longer not all protoss units have been revealed yet not to mention buildings...

 

Protoss gameplay is ok. Noone mentind colossus cliff-walking, phase prism mobile energy field??? stalker blink???

 

^ No kidding. Colossus' cliff walk uses the same mechanic as reaper's base raid.

I like the new abilities the protoss have. I know there is much carried over from the original starcraft, but as Fenix sort of mentioned, they are an old and mystic race. Terran's however, are all about adaptability, so it's expected that they have developed many new mechanics.

Also, the game has a LONG way to come before it will be released, so i'm sure blizzard will explore every avenue and by the end, when your playing SC2, you won't be able to decide which race is the best because everything will be balanced (hopefully).

Just like good ol' SC1

 

it's sort of true that the Protoss haven't changed much.but i really can't see them changing from how they are now.i mean,terrans are all about flexibility,while Protoss are the conservative race.Blizzard itself says this

yes,it can be used as a lame excuse to add few new mechanics to the protoss,but i trust in Blizzard,and i trust they will add many new mechanics to the Protoss,so that when we can buy the game,the protoss will be notably different from how they are in SC1

they are conservative,but the merging of cultures they have now can offer them many new possibilities.lore-wise,they would be fools if they didn't take advantage of that.and reality-wise,the blizzard team would be fools if they didn't take advantage of that to create many new things for the Protoss.out of all races,they are the ones that can have the most new things,due to what i have just said.

 

umm, actually, uniqueness is first, then balance. Which is why blizzard is testing with all sorts of units to see how it makes the race feel like. Once they got a good set of units, then they start refining and balancing.

We know pretty much most of the buildings and units from blizzcon. Sure they could add a new ability, but overall, it's the same.

Look at reviews of the game from blizzcon. According to many people, playing terran was a real new feel. They had to improvise based on this new style. Protoss is like the exact same feel. You start off the same, with the same build, you end up pretty much similar. So many people do feel that protoss are really similar.

I'm talking mechanics, not abilities. Some cool abilities i've heard is allowing overlapping pylons to create force fields or some shield recharging area. Other mechanics include: giving buildings a "battery" so when pylons are destroyed they stay online for a few seconds, allowing all protoss units to get two forms, one regular form, and one that has increased attack and less shield (channel energy to attack)....

These are mechanics. They apply to the whole race and makes gameplay different.

Yes, the merge of DT and Aiur protoss should be expressed. The tempest was a great idea, but it got cut (for now).

I believe in blizzard too. I understand that if I just sat here I'm sure they could develop a great game. But that's what fan discussions are for, so they know what the public wants. I mean, they could develop graphics, gameplay, realism and all sorts of things. If there wasn't a discussion, I'm sure it would be hard for blizzard to decide which one to go for. Because of fansites and fan discussion, blizzard knows that the older community loves the gameplay, and cares less about graphics. So that's what they do.

 

I love the Protoss graphics. I think that they are perfect.

However, the Terrans do seem to have more new mechanics than the Protoss. I would not mind if they got a few new things besides warping units and moving cannons (even though these two things are going to be used in many ways.) I would be willing to overlook the lack of mechanics if they would just put the Reaver back in though...

 

remember, young ones, that sc2 is a new game, it doesnt have to differ that much from sc1 as long as the races are more different and the protoss and terran are different and i dont see how they could screw up the zerg so

 

Reaver was just used to death IMO. Then again siege tanks...yea...
On a side note: I read some lore on the SC2 site.
"The colossus is unusual for the fact that it was created purely as a war machine. Most protoss robots are created for industrial or resource-gathering purposes. Even the much-feared reaver is at its core a mobile manufacturing unit re-tasked to the creation of scarab drones for long-range bombardment."
Makes me think too much of a NYC hotdog vender or something.

I think that warpin/mobile canons are two such powerful new mechanics that blizz left it at that. I wouldn't argue the addition of one more new mechanic though.

EDIT: This may actually make a good argument for the Mother Ship unique unit concept.

 

i don't understand what do you mean by that...

yes,SC 2 is still at it's beggining,we are not even in beta,because there is no Zerg,at least no enough like the Protoss and Terrans,but i think elite-guard's concerns are valid.yes,the game doesn't have to be entirely different from SC1,but new mechanics wouldn't hurt,and would add to the felling of this being a sequence,not some 3d expansion set.the Protoss need to be more different from their former selves in SC1,but than again,i may really be overlook their newfound mobility.maybe this is far more impactating to the protoss gameplay than i suspect...

 

actually SC2 is in the beta: they just dont have good zerg graphics yet, they are constantly talking about their constant BETA build

 

sc2 is not in beta and they have never said that they were. They havn't even announced alpha yet.


edit; to nip this before the noobs come calling with "I'm pretty sure its in beta and released by december"
check out Chris Sigaty's latest interview with gametrailers(blizzcon), in which he clearly states that they are in Pre Alpha

 

oh ok srry, never heard that before i only heard talkings by karune about the beta build

 

I was saying that a single unique MS would be a new mechanic. If people want to see that, it would be a good argument to throw out there.
Thinking about it now; people have thrown out the do something new argument at the MS debate before,

 

The stasis orb is a cool new mechanic imo, the building cloak by the mothership, the planet cracker, the time bomb, the hardened shield of the immortal, blink, merging Dark Templar with High templar, the warp ray is a great new mechanic, the way the zealot charges, the movable cannon, the phase prism, we dont even know much about the high templar besides that it will have psionic storm.

 

Hi, I think i'd wait with conclusion on the renovations coz the toss-chart isn't quite finnished yet, but 4now terrans do indeed look like they 've become even more tactical, stealthy,flexible, tricky and more creative than toss. And I know that it might be just as it suppose to be ( diff principles and all that ) yet still, i'd have loved to see them( toss) come-up with some refreshingly-clever way to create some units or to overcome their enemies in general. Afterall they're known not only 4 their heavily-developed psy-abilitites, but also great wisdom in handling those (apparently).

Bout them units, Immortals kinda seem to need more design-smoothinging, they sorta look bumpy right now. I'd add some FX/animation to their charge-blast aswel; displays kinda hollow and without character, borring to watch :-\

Stargate-design-dynamics look just awesome, hope all their upcomming structures will be realized with equal share of creativity.(unlike the WG ) TNX

 

Ok, Dkutrovsky, most of what you said are ABILITIES. It's dependant on the unit. Yes, the hardened shield is a wonderful new ability that influences matchups and in a way some parts of strategy. But mechanics are the things that create totally new strategies.

So the hardended shield as an example. It will cause PVT matches to be different. Terran can't just mass metal anymore. They must think up of a new way to outsmart the Protoss.

However, the warp-in is a mechanic. Instead of forcing a player to do something else, it allows the creation of a new strategy. Abilities can cause someone to think up of new ways to work with what they have, mechanics give people new tools to work with.

My main basis for this argument is that many blizzcon players have stated that the terran was mind blowing. Without mass metal, and vultures, gameplay was flipped. Early infantry was finally very important, and teching higher to planes was important as well. VERY different because of the new mechanics, new units, and new building order.

HOWEVER, people who played protoss felt that nothing had changed. The build order is pretty much exactly the same, with cybernetics having a different role now. You tech to twilight (similar to tech to core) and then choose one of 3 tech trees to start on. The only new thing was the new units and abilities, and the warp-in mechanic. The phase cannon phase ability is cool, and it gives a minor tool for us to work with. For these people, they feel that the protoss were cooler, but they relatively did not change compared to the terran. In a 1-10 meaning 10 is totally different, the protoss would get a 3/4 while the terran would get like a 7/8.

some ideas I've created and others have are:
- using overlapping matrix to create a forcefield or shield battery. Makes overlapping pylons able to be strategically placed.
- giving protoss some sort of space time warp ability, almost like a nydus worm to be able to open a hole in 2 areas, where units pass between.
- give probes a better function than just warping buildings. Maybe warp-in mines/bombs/units.

These are some mechanics. Another problem is to really change some part of the BO of protoss buildings so new strategies will form and old ones will diminish, like giving them a larger tree, or a shorter one. (Just like how the terran now have an infantry tree branching off from the barracks.