new idea. new banshee. new role.

SORRY for the bad english.

imo the banshee is redundant bcoz terran got tons of ground AOE damage dealer already. plus the banshee right now function like a terran guardian plus the cloak. i say give it a new role like this...^^








i say save the missile for a terran gta unit. and since we all miss the wraith give the atg laser of the wraith to the banshee... and the normal mode of the banshee is not really effective just like the wraith atg was in sc1. however the new ambush mode is very effective as well as the new driller missile ability. the driller missiles is not spammable it is limited just like the vulture mine so that terran observer or detectors will still be always use. ^^

im just trying to make the banshee more unqiue than just an AOE bomber or a single missile attacker.. this one has a true function and mechanic unlike the single missile attacking banshee.

i made it shoot laser instead of missiles bcoz like i said it should not be AOE anymore... but now it has an ability aoe "driller missile".

yes the ambusher mode funntion just like the tank (siege mode)... you switch modes. but you get fast attack instead.

in normal mode the banshee still moves fast and can cloak. but in aerial ambusher mode it cannot move so lorewise it can focus fire on incoming enemies (firing faster than usual). it can also cloak while on ambusher mode making it a deadly stealth ambusher.

the normal mode attack of the banshee is not really effective just to make the unit more balance and have some weakness. the main function of this banshee would be the ambush mode and the driller missiles.

it creates more micro and strategy as well which is a good thing.

and the driller missiles does not deal damage like the nuke ofcourse. i said the way you launch it is just like the nuke.

well you can use them too to protect you tanks. place them above your tanks in aerial ambusher mode in a defensive situation.

 

I don't know why the Banshee is under so much criticism and everyone wants to make it different. Personally, I thought the very first Banshee with the AoE bombing missles was best.

 

well i still think the AOE banshee is redundant and overlaps too much... and right now its just a terran guardian and is boring as hell with its single missile attack.

the aerial ambusher role i think fits the planetary purposes of this unit imo.

 

The Banshee isn't AOE anymore BTW
Nor was the guardian

 

i know... we know ^^

 

I think it would be rather unfair to have something like the Driller Missiles going specifically for burrowed Zerg units.

Although I do like the Ambush mode because it would be deliciously evil to have.
Cloak in a bunch of Banshees, then turn on Ambush.

Banshees coming out of nowhere and suddenly delivering a beatdown...
I like it.

 

yes i can imagine the aerial ambusher very effective and as an exciting mechanic, like luring a bunch of hydralisk or zealots to a certain ground not knowing there are several cloak banshee in ambusher mode waiting there ready to fire multiple lasers on each enemy unit. ^^

the driller missiles would be optional, say one (actually firing 2 at the same time) for each banshee available, if you dont have a detector yet you can use your driller missiles and fire it closely where you think the burrowed zerg units are and hopefully will kill them.

 

I must say your driller missile is a SO GENIAL IDEA!
But right now the banshee inst AoE, so right now there is not overlap...

 

thanks.

actually i thought of a new mechanic that would counter burrowed zerg unit at first for my new ued concept race, the ued bullfrog which serve as a transport but have an eletrical system driller which can electrocute burrowed zerg sorrounding it. but since the banshee IMO right now is just plain boring and doesn't have a clear define role i decided to give it an attack to counter burrowed units.

i know the banshee is not currently aoe, but the problem is imo is the single "missile" attack which is really uninspired and not sci fi innovative enough.

 

With all due respect, I understand how much time and consideration you've obviously put into this, it pains me to read this. No offence, but it's hard to even know where to start. It's not that it's just plain crap or anything, I just strongly disagree with almost everything you've suggested. Anyway, here goes. I'll try to be brief.
First off, the design. I know that you've got a limited access for stuff like this, but it looks cramped and dysfunctional. You've added far to much to it and it reminds me of a little kid with those huge bulky hiking backpacks. I don't understand why you hate the helicopter design so much. It was simple, it was sleek and above all it was unique. Also, it's got to be able to Cloak. That was the beauty of the old design. There were no jet engines to theoretically give away its position. The new design looks as though it's got several twin-linked heavy flamethrowers constantly firing out of each engine. Not practical, not stealthy and not a good design.
Secondly and thirdly, the Normal Mode and Ambush Mode. I see no advantage in giving the Banshee an ineffective normal mode. It doesn't balance it and it doesn't add some weakness. The Banshee is only able to attack Ground targets. That is both its advantage and weakness. If it's being attacked from the Ground, it'll just shift into its Ambush Mode, if it's being attacked from the skies, it'll just fly off. If the Banshee is only effective in its Ambush Mode, meaning that players would have to shift in and out to move and continue attacking, why not just cut out the middle man and make the ambush attack its normal attack? It still has to be stationary to shoot because it can't move while shooting, it would shift into that mode anyway when being attacked from the Ground or it would fly off anyway if it's being attacked from the skies. Also, there isn't a need for an Ambush Mode to begin with. It can be ordered to Cloak and Hold Ground if you want it to be, so why do you need it, apart from giving it the increased attack speed which it should have in its Normal Mode anyway. Also, you say that the engines will be turned off for the Ambush Mode, but if that's the case, how would it hover? Get in any aircraft, turn off all the engines and see what happens. Not to mention that all effective ambushers, namely the Lurker, have an area of effect attack. They have this because it means that they can take out all the units as quickly as possible. Having a single target ambusher, unless you're trying to assassinate a particular unit, will be much slower at dispatching any incoming force.
Fourthly, the Driller Missiles. A missile that drills underground and detonates with enough force to tear the land apart and damage the surrounding area would look completely cheesy in StarCraft2. Underground explosions of that magnitude would reshape the landscape which is impossible to have a suitable animation for unless it physically did in which case it would be completely unbalanced in StarCraft2.
Fifthly, the lasers. Not only do the guns and projectiles look puncy, but they're old and outdated. Again, you say that you want it to be more unique, but you're removing the uniqueness of the design and attack. Never before have the Terran had a helicopter unit nor have they had any Air-to-Ground rockets. In this redesign you've single-handedly removed both these features.
There's no real need for the Ambush Mode and to be as effective at ambushing as possible, it needs an area of effect attack, and after it's been given this area of effect attack it should no longer need the Driller Missile. In the end, you're basically back to the original Banshee.

 

well for me the helicopter design is something you see everyday so imo the banshee would not be an interesting unit, it will be known simply by looking like a copter which again imo is not good enough. the siege tank is an exception bcoz it was in sc1. we are in sc2 why not make the best out of unit design and modeling, this is sci fi, countless original innovative designs can be made by blizzard. for me the banshee would be a waste of a unit if both the attack and design remains the same. the helicopter is just plain and simple and old style... i want some innovative sci fi look at least on some part of it... and this is where the twin engine comes in and i prefer better. its more of a sci fi design actually and good for starcraft than the rotors.

think of the goliath... mediocre gtg(weakness) but still kinda useful. the banshee in normal mode acts that way too (mediocre attack - weakness) but it can still move and follow enemies and attack them(still useful). the goliath's gta attacks would be the ambusher mode of the banshee which is the most effective.

the banshee is an ambusher meaning its main function is to ambush incoming enemies. this banshee is not good enough to fight against enemies firing back. or not good on open combat.

the ambush mode + normal mode is the mechanic / tactic use by this unit. both have different purpose and will create many micro and tactics.

in ambush mode you can move so you need to wait for your opponents. you dont use ambush mode in an open combat specially against mass enemy units bcoz banshee dont have enough HP and is not AOE. but you can take a risk and use it since its better than the normal mode with its faster attack, the only drawback is it takes time to switch mode and you cant easily retreat while in ambush mode. plus again they are NOT really meant for open combat but rather for ambushing/ support on tanks/ or worker raids.

maybe a secret turbo rotor will be use etc. come on this is possible since its sci fi. i only made this mechanic bcoz when you are cloak in ambush mode there should be no visible fire or else it will be useless.

you need several banshee to effectively ambush incoming several enemies. say 1 banshee in ambush mode will fire 3 lasers in a sec and kill immdiately a single hydralisk.

even now i still wonder how the zerg units can easily burrow on any grounds they want even on space platform. now the ultralisk can burrow to using its 4 huge claws. wow.

just a simple small earthquake and dust effect on the targeted are. how hard is that?

note: the driller missile damages only burrowed enemy units.

that is just boring ambushing. mine is ambushing with style. micro and new mechanics and more balance.

 

You see the SC2 Banshee's design every day because you come from the Koprulu sector or because you visit the offical site's terran section every day?

I am sorry, but making Banshees only useful in TvZ is a horrible idea. They should be viable in every matchup.

If that's the case, why not make it use those secret rotors ALL the time?

 

GMG I cant see how you think making one of the units abillities not usefull in one match up is bad. What about the snipe, that one is mostly usefull against Z, iridiate is/was only used against Z too. So I can see no problem in that one.

 

Since when is the Snipe only useful in TvZ? Zerglings and Hydras won't be worth the energy, only detected Lurkers, Mutas and Roaches will be worth it. Sniping Medics (if they return), Marauders and other Ghosts will be seen in TvT, and in TvP, Snipe will own Zealots and High Templars. Snipe is definitely not an anti Zerg ability.

Irradiate was only used vs. Zerg, but EMP was only used vs. Protoss, right? Now, does the "new Banshee" have an equivalent of the EMP? Nope. Irradiate was anti Zerg, but not the entire Science Vessel.

 

EMP was never used, as it wasnt usefull enought. Ok you are right on the other part ANd Irradiate + Detector was the whole SV, ever looked Boxer against Z players?

 

You know i'm kinda worried the terrans dont have a irradiate to use agenst flesh units. I dont see how terrans are going to hold out agenst big nasty units like an ultralisk...

 

You're talking about pro-gaming. I am not. From MY point of view, EMP WAS used, and it was NOT in TvZ matchups.
This new Banshee has a spell that can only hurt Zerg units, under certain circumstances. There is no excuse for that.

 

GMG I know YOU know that I always talk pro-gaming, because thats were the balance is. And, why is SC so well known? Because of pro-gaming.
On the other hand, Im also against the abillity ,because of this:
Is Blizzard making WC4?
I dont want every unit to have 3 abillities, and isnt that whats happening?

 

Helicopters may be seen everyday, but none like the Banshee. The types we see are the news helicopters, the fire helicopters and occasionally the odd transport helicopter shown on the news. None are like the Banshee. Wanting to redesign the Banshee because it looks like an 'everyday' helicopter is like wanting to redesign the Viking's Air Form because it looks like a Boeing.
Also, you're making exclusions for the Siege Tank because it's in StarCraft1, but only four years have past since the events of StarCraft1, so if it was acceptable for them to build fairly regular tanks back then, why is it so blasphemous that they have helicopters now? Also, what of all the other units? What of the Jackal? It just looks like a regular bike. What of the Marine? It just looks like a regular man. There doesn't have to be anything special about Terran. Sure, it's in the future, but they've been set back so far what with the limited resources, population of convicts, being overrun by the technologically and psychically superior Protoss and biologically superior Zerg etc, etc. The fact that they're able to get a helicopter off the ground is amazing enough. From the sounds of things and from what you keep bringing up about the Terran in as many topics as you can, you just want the Terran to be another amazingly technologically superior race. That would be lame. It would get rid of the defined differentiation between them and the Protoss and make them so much less hardcore, which is another thing you always want. Post-modern humans taking on futuristic space aliens, that is hardcore.
The Goliath is a terrible example to use. It always has an Anti-Ground and Anti-Air attack and can always move. The Banshee only has an Anti-Ground attack and half the time it's immobilised. Think of the Goliath? I think not.
You're right in saying that both the Normal Mode and Ambush Mode have a different purpose. One's for fighting the other's for fleeing. The Ambush Mode can be achieved anyway by Cloaking and ordering your Banshees to Hold Ground. Not only does that set up an ambush but they won't need to have these two modes, one with a redundant attack.
About the 'secret turbo rotor', as GasMaskGuy said, why not just let it have regular rotors? You're so against the Banshee design because it's got rotors, but you're including rotors in a key aspect of your redesign. You say that when Cloaked in Ambush Mode there should be no visible fire, when in reality when Cloaked in any mode there should be no visible fire. The solution? Just let the Banshee have rotors.
A Banshee could kill one Hydralisk in one second, eh? Well, not only is that eighty damage per second, but when have you ever seen a Zerg swarm going around in small numbers? In order for that to be an effective ambush you'd need about fifty-odd Banshees.
Again, the Driller Missiles only working against Burrowed units is just terrible. Even if it did damage against all units, it's still terrible. Why would they design an explosive that digs underground before detonating? The ground would just absorb the impact meaning that the area of effect radius would be drastically reduced and the units inside that lessened radius would take less damage. I don't know why you brought up Zerg Burrowing. It has little to do with whether the Driller Missile would work or not.
So the practical way of ambushing is boring is it? Your impractical way of ambushing is ambushing with style is it? There is next to no additional micro opportunities, it's an old mechanic and it doesn't help with balance at all.

@ furrer. EMP was quite useful, and not only against Protoss. It wasn't useful against Zerg as the Queen's abilities didn't change the course of the game, and the Defiler could Consume. However against Terran and Protoss is was a valuable ability. It could stop advancing Battlecruisers from using Yamato Cannon, completely mess up Medics for Terran, and against Protoss is was the second most powerful ability in the game, wiping all shields, nullifying all High Templar and practically killing both Archons and Dark Archons.

 

@furrer
No, no it isn't. Also, you have it wrong. Sc1 isn't well known because of pro-gaming it's well known because of why it was good for pro-gaming and that is its balance on many levels. On that note though I still don't like the driller missle idea. It can only be used against the Zerg. Thats what sets it apart from EMP and Iraddiate, both of those abilities could be used against other races besides Protoss and Zerg respectively, even though weren't as effective. The driller missle can only be used again the Zerg and that's a big no-no as far as abilities are concerned.

I will say this though Zeratul I do like the idea of giving the Banshee a rocket based engine. Here is my suggestion move the the rocket enegine to the back and put the propellers back and when the Banshee is cloacked it uses the propellers and is a somewhat slower. As far as the attack goes I don't like the mode idea for the Banshee, if the attack is changed thats fine but it should still be similar in effect to what it is currently.