My Thor fix

INTRO

As seen in BR4 the thor is massable and capable of handling almost all types of enemy units. It has decent ground damage and air damage. It also can act as a tank.

Together with the marauder, other units like the viking and tanks are most of the time unnecessary.

Originally the thor was presented as a very powerful attack unit with a major weakness, it moves extremely slow and also rotates slow while attacking. In BR4 none of this weakness are present.

The thor seems to have turned into a terran normal core massable attack units instead of making it a specialized unit which i prefer.

Why would you still make marines, banshee, viking etc in a straight fight if you have lots of minerals, just make plenty of thors since it really has no real weakness and has all the firepower.

So here is my thor fix. Pros and Cons. Purpose of it and counters against it.

THOR FIX

+Make the thor move epic slow when moving, its damn fitting. Siege tanks, warp rays, guardians will own this thing easily since it still has to move (epic slow) to be able to reach its attack range.

+ Give the thor a slow charging energy blast attack or a red devil mega energy pulse blaster canon that deals massive damage against single unit as its normal attack. Kills tank in 2 shots. Kills roaches and marauders instantly.

So the main purpose of the thor is to destroy strong enemy units like tanks, colossus, ultralisk or any light ground units in few numbers easily except immortals.

Give it an energy base weapon to make the thing look more impressive. Shells and projectiles for this kind of heavy mech is just plain mediocre. Just look at it in BR4. The look of the giant thing is epic the attack is bland.

+ Another important weakness and so that the energy beam visual will work is to make the thor unable attack enemies at close or melee range.

Zealot and other melee units attacking as thor can never be attack back by the thor. The thor wont fire its beam at nearby enemies just like the siege tank in siege mode. Micro here for the big fella.

+ The above mentioned weakness actually presented another purpose for the thor mech which is to act as a tank. So give the thor more hp than usual.

+ Remove the back flak canons because its the one that makes the crucio tanks sometimes useless. It looks awful and trying hard as well. Replace it to an uver missile launch pod to attack enemy light air units.

The thor don't need ground splash damage, its one of its weakness and separates its from the ultralisk, colosus, and archons which all do splash damage. Ground splash damage is already the tanks role.

+ The thor act now as a specialized powerful unit and is not meant to be mass produce unless you are facing mass light air units. The thor is there to act as a tank for your troops and to take down strong enemy units like archons, tanks, colossus.

+ Battlecruiser (w/ yamato) or any heavy armored air units, Guardian, lurkers, immortals, warp rays, tanks (siege mode), Dark templar, mass light ground units close to the thor are the perfect counters.

+ Ultralisk, Colossus, Archon, are strong AOE damage dealer, the thor deals massive damage against single unit. Big difference.

BONUS: Because the thor can't attack enemies at close range, maybe the rebirth ability will work or something else like self destruct ability.


MARAUDER FIX


+ Remove the bonus damage against armored enemy of the marauder.

It conflicts with the siege tank and the thor. Without it the marauders will not be massed going up against all enemy ground units.

 

Very nice ideas....especially regarding the Thor... but im afraid Terran lovers won't like it

 

That's a lot...

+Make the thor move epic slow when moving, its damn fitting. Siege tanks, warp rays, guardians will own this thing easily since it still has to move (epic slow) to be able to reach its attack range

- First of all, this is probably the most significant matter that they have to deal with, speed for a ground unit of that size shouldn't be able to move along with siege tank pace. If there's no remedy, I suggest they do the team movement modification like in WC3 but that is not the right answer because it'll also affect your fast units. So imo make it as slow as the broodlord or the battlecruiser perhaps.

+ Give the thor a slow charging beam or ray canon that deals massive damage against single unit as its normal attack. Kills tank in 2 shots. Kills roaches and marauders instantly.

- Warp rays already had that attack type and we certainly don't want to be a copycat of that. Plus making its attack power as powerful as that is no different from a siege mode tank. They are more suited that way as an anti air and structure type unit so I have no problems with that. This unit is not a SUPER unit, and it does not need an uber attack that can kill roaches and marauders in an instant. Big guns always works for terran, its a non alien tech and it really certifies that shell technology will never fade even after years to come. Bullets are no mediocre weaponry, its just a matter of accessibility. In that matter just consider that missiles are overpowered bullets in a way, so don't underestimate it because it's no mediocre unit as I can see. Shells are perfect for the Thors size since it has to store a lot of ammunition for it to dispose such damage. This units main purpose is fine for me right now.

+ Another important weakness and so that the energy beam visual will work is to make the thor unable attack enemies at close or melee range.

- I agree with this, it's the perfect weakness for the thor, but you have to wonder what terran unit is melee besides the Firebat and SCV? Lol

+ Remove the back flak canons because its the one that makes the crucio tanks sometimes useless. It looks awful and trying hard as well. Replace it to an uver missile launch pod to attack enemy light air units.

- No. The Flak cannons are intended for air units and what hindrance does that give for Crucio Tanks? I haven't noticed the attack animation for the flak attacks but giving it a missile launch pod might not be the best solution. Flaks do splash and missiles are targeted which would result to the thor being less useful. It doesn't overlap with tanks at all since Thors don't do splash on ground. But maybe a damage tone is necessary if needed to. Someone from blizzcon09 reported that specifically on how does the Thor function, I can't recall exactly but its kind of a double barrage attack and I think it was about 30x2 dmg on a single target.

+ The thor act now as a specialized powerful unit and is not meant to be mass produce unless you are facing mass light air units. The thor is there to act as a tank for your troops and to take down strong enemy units like archons, tanks, colossus.

- This spot is already taken by the Battlecruiser and there is no changing that. Despite how massive you think the Thor is. It's definitely not even close to half the size of a Battlecruiser. And for it's points, the BC does all the special functions that you want the thor to be. Being a damage dealer with Yamato, Uber tank with defensive matrix and even massive destruction by torpedo missiles. Right now the BC is the unit that is meant to be the Flagship and symbol of Terran power. (It can even withstand a Nuke)

BONUS: Because the thor can't attack enemies at close range, maybe the rebirth ability will work or something else like self destruct ability.

- I'm not sure if it's automated self repair ability is still in-game but I sure hope it still does.

+ Remove the bonus damage against armored enemy of the marauder.

- Marauders specialize dealing heavy damage to armored units and that makes them very unique among all terran ground units. Without that specialty they will basically just be another Marine with a slowing effect and over-sized armor. Tanks do bonus damage on lighter units so its instant death for light armored ones like hydras and zerglings. Thors are more of a siege engine for structure destruction and air defense. So it basically does not overlap with any of the tanks and thors traits.

Overall I really have to agree with adding the weakness for Thor being unable to fireback against melee range. Other than that, the Thor is now unique and I certainly want them that way. Marauders without bonus damage = marines with better hp that cant even attack air... think about it. ^_^

 

No text wall from me, just this:

Energy beam? No thanks. It's a Terran unit. A railgun should be fine. Further, it has nothing to do with how the unit works.

As for everything that turns it into a tank unit: not a chance of that ever happening. It almost got axed before because it had to much overlap with the Siege Tank. So it's already decided by pretty much everybody that this is a bad idea.

I'm all for less speed, though. It's ridiculous that such a thing can turn that fast. It should be more like those mechs from the matrix. (The turning speed and way of walking, not the weapons.)

The new slow attack you came up with is already there. The ability of the Thor is a single target attack that does a lot of damage, so why make that it's main attack? We don't want a few Thors to be able to take out a Nexus / Hive / Command Center in a few seconds anymore. If it was purposed to be able to do that, then we'd still have the old bombard ability.

Lastly, it's anti-air isn't that bad. I just fail to see your problem with it.

 

Exactly, bc speed in ground mode.

Ok I already edited the attack I meant. It was not a charging beam like the warp rays weapon but something like the bc attack. The original thor attacks have a red beam coming out, I like to see it again but this time looking more intense and powerful.

Well the difference is the siege tank does splash damage while the thor doesn’t. And the thor is meant to assault and take hit while the tanks are meant for long range bombardment and defense.
I know bullets are not mediocre but it’s really obvious that it’s mediocre for uver heavy and advance looking sci fi unit like the thor considering the technology advancement of the terran. They have laser. Period. And it’s a matter of where to put it on. The thor is a clear candidate considering its hard to destroy, top tier, advance, and has all the part to handle it. Energy weapons are normal for most huge sci-fi mech and I don’t want the thor to be left behind.

I always wanted a melee ghost. Perhaps marine doing melee attacks in the campaign. Their armor can punch through wall and they can lift cars and tress if im not mistaken.

Watch BR4. The flak canon on its back attacks ground units just like when it was originally introduced. It deals splash damage on enemy ground untis it is powerful as well on buildings.
The thor doesn’t have an anti air ability as seen in recent videos. The four shoulder tubes fires missile against enemy air units as a normal attack.

Well the thor is the ground bc. You need a ground tanker as well.

In BR4, the thor dies only once.

I agree, but mass marauder will make the marine sometimes useless if you have support anti-air like viking and thors.

 

Wraith, the battlecruiser, and ion canon are terran units. teran have energy weapons.

What i meant tank was a damage taker not the siege tank.

i have no problem with its anti air attack. Anti air is its main role with decent ground attack, thats why i disagree with the thor having an AOE ground attack ability it makes the unit too powerful and massable.

 

Those are just typical standard lasers. Not energy weapons. There's a difference.

 

I personally agree with most of Zeratul11's ideas. I don't know about you, other members ? I see that some of you contest and give other ideas.

The Thor is a huge unit so that normally it should move slowly, turn around itself slowly, etc ... to be realistic. BUT for the gameplay it is not applyable. This unit would be very weak against fast units. Remember the Terran gameplay footage of 2007 when the Thor was built in the battlefield because it was a so huge unit. And it moved slowly, but was very strong ! And the cobra destroyed the Thor in the video because it was slow.

NOW ??? It is built in the factory, as a normal Tank, moves fast as a Goliath, both of his cannon arms attack faster than in the original video, and it is of course weaker. It is now like the Mothership. We don't know its status.

I miss the animation of the SCV building it, and when it was destroyed.

Will the gameplay in multi be the same in solo ? Will the Thor be huge, heavy in solo, but fast as a Goliath in multi ? Look at the Medivac Dropship, how the player microed this unit and the ghost. The dropship didn't land to drop the unit. Of course else it would have been impossible to micro as the player did. But some animations disappear in multi. Can we see, for example, the dropship land in solo, and not in multi ?

 

Why would the slow speed be bad if a Cobra can counter it? It's called a counter. As the Thor is now, it's easy to mass, and it can take on just about any other unit. Great gta vs light, decent gtg vs all, awesome single target ability, great turning and "running" speed... It's ridiculous.

 

We really appreciated how the Thor was in the very beginning of the adventures of SC2 when we just discovered the Thor. Built out in the battlefield, so huge, so heavy, so slow, but so powerful. Now we see it as a huge Goliath. Of course now it is more playable. But the CHARM of the Thor is lost. It was a unique unit as it was before. As the Mothership was before too, and now look how this other unit become.

 

+1

As any balanced units, Thor needs at least some sort of weakness... like speed (which isnt per se a real weakness) and unability to do melee fights. And why does it come out of Fax? I preferred the original concept by far.

 

The only thing i agree with is tis movement speed and its minimal range. Everything else that it currently has needs to stay the same. I think if the thor had a minimal range it would Give it all the possible ideas to beat. most low tier units would wreck thor at that point. Zerglings/zealot/stalkers thats not to also mention late tier units like immortals will still counter it so i think that would be enough. As for the other things like the removal of its Anti air thats over doing it. Vikings in ground form cant shoot up and you'll still need a tech unit that is anti air. Thor can still take that role. You need to keep in mind what units got replaced. Wraith and Goliath.

 

thor is a devastating machine...

 

No it isn't. Just because you can buy four of them doesn't make them massable. They're expensive and cost 6 supply each.

If it wasn't for its GtA role, I would support it. However, it does have the anti-muta ball role, and the only other way to fix that is to bring back the predator, which increases the unit count.

Please explain this charging attack a bit. Is it just an animation (high damage, low RoF) or does it work like a void ray? You did say it instantly kills some units, so I'm guessing the first.

It does use an energy weapon, at least in lore. So do siege tanks, it's just not obvious.

Hell no. Siege tanks already have this weakness, and for good reason. If a unit gets in the thor's face, and it can't shoot them, it should just step on them (or kick them).

Who says thors do splash vs ground?

Why? This gives marauders the ability to crush buildings. I'd rather see them lose stimpack; they seem scarily effective with it.

Currently neither siege tanks nor thors do bonus damage vs armored.

 

Ok I don't like pretty much anything you sugested, sry

A Thor vs 6 lings wouldn't stand a chance In a "1v1" a couple lings are taken out (considering you have speed by then or youre on creep) get to it and then it's a little bit of get to the back of the Thor and pound at it and do a little micro so the thor doesn't kill you, or bring in like 15 lings and the will be easy to take down.

Also hiding some banelings in the middle of a choke or in the middle of the map would basicly be an instant kill (10 explod underground and boom Thor dead)

Marauder needs no stim, I think of gives it too much menuverabilty, and if no bonus to heavy it is what other people said, a marine with more HP and no air att.

And Thor needs no melée disadvantage (it's on the tank)
And lasers = big fat no, save lasers for the protoss, you like lasers play Protoss.

 

@Kimera
Always thought that Ar****e was some sort of shell? If it's an energy weapon, then why such a long barrel and an explosion on impact? A bit strange that the animations don't follow the lore.

And again: I don't have the manual in the stupid combo box I bought. And no, I haven't looked at the digital version yet. Stupid pdf crap.

 

But if you have all the minerals, its obvious the thor is the best choice to mass since it can do almost everything. Tank, good against ground, have a strong ground damage ability, and very strong against air units as well.

Yeah I like the predator. I think the thor should not have a normal anti-air attacks, give it an ability instead like long range missile devastator.

No its nothing like the warp ray. My idea is like a red fireball blast but its charges first just like the yamato.

Siege tank have energy weapon. Can you explain further. You mean it doesn’t shoots any canon balls etc. Yes I heard it was plasma base but I don’t get it.

I think its fits the thor and make early tier units still usefull in most late games since they can counter the thor mech easily. Zerglings and zealots will give the thor a problem. But anyway if you back up your thor with other units or thor the one getting beat still can be save. Also it already acted as a tank so its ok anyway, plus you can retreat it anytime since it doesn’t die easily anyway against zealots zerglings or marines upclose.

The canon ability is single targer. My mistake.

 

The Thor will get the same weakness as the Sieged mode Tank. Zerglings for instance will beat the Thor by their melee attack. So the best combination would be to form a group of marines or marauders with the Thor.

i see the Thor as a ground Battlecruiser. In space a huge battlecruiser should need the assistance of hunters to protect him. This huge unit is slow and cant't defend itself against little and fast enemies. Just look at yourself when you are trying to hunt a mosquito that attacked you.
So the Thor needs some little units to protect it.

So that's why I suggested 1 year ago (or more) to add inside the Thor some sorts of bunker to load marines to defend it. But it would be radically a disadvantage for other races of course !

 

Siege tanks have energy weapons: http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/starcraft/images/0/0b/TerrVehicles_SC-G_BlizzCon2005.jpg

"Zerglings and zealots will give the thor a problem. But anyway if you back up your thor with other units or thor the one getting beat still can be save."

They're a problem for the thor anyway. Unlike a siege tank, it doesn't deal splash. It isn't a siege tank; it should have some other weakness. (And logically, it can just step on zerglings.)

 

yes, but this game isn't found on logic.

P.S. and is the grizzly and the stinger supost to be something in the editer, or is it something that they took out? or is it like totally pimped out versions on the helion and dropship?