Kerrigan. A queen or just a hero?

I was just wondering what place/role you think Kerrigan will take? I think when you play in the campaign you'll get Kerrigan instead of a queen. Your thoughts...

 

You'll probally get both since the queen is just a unit made to protect the hive but not nessicarily command it or control it like a celebrate does because if it dies you can always just "Grow" another one while kerrigan is irreplacable! Kerrigan will just be a kick butt hero in my opinion.

 

nope you're wrong.. its not a probability that you'll get both, rather its a situational chance that you'll get both... to put it simplier, the hive queen unit is a non-hero type unit, on the other hand kerrigan is a hero-type unit and also named queen of blades, not just plain queen.....

some campaign missions will be with kerrigan herself and some will be w/o hero, so thats just common sense that the Queen and Queen of blades are entirely definitely different Units with different roles and different skills...

Hive Queen ------------------------------------- Queen of Blades

*Aquired through hatchery------------------ *Instant appearance
*Improves skills through upgrades------ *Already has her own set of skills
*If killed in action, can be purchased---- *If killed in action, most likely
again but with penalty of losing her---- that your mission is failure or needed
upgraded skills------------------------------ to be restarted

there now, at least you'll have a small glimpse of the queens in SC2

 

Kerrigan may function as a Queen in StarCraft2. Zerg are always evolving so who's to say that Kerrigan couldn't have further evolved into a Queen? The normal Queen model has a very humanoid torso, which I doubt they would have ever done otherwise, and easily allows for a Kerrigan/Queen model. Also in the Zerg announcement trailer, despite the whole thing being narrated by Kerrigan, she never seems to appear in it. The shots of a Queen overlooking destroyed planets, and particularly the extreme close up of the Queens face, along with Kerrigan constantly using terms like 'we thrived', 'we evolved' and 'we are becoming much much more' show that he's involved in what we're seeing, plus the fact that she's constantly referring to evolution, etc, could also suggest that she, too, has evolved. Anyway, that's my take on it. Feel free to disagree.

 

i may have to disagree with that coz putting the fact hat they made the Queen unit as a very defensive role type unit means that it is definitely not very much portreying Kerrigans "insane psyche" into it... though the probability of evolution is very high.... it still doesnt conclude that kerrigan has become the queen...

plus the fact that the hive queens ussually are disposable unit means that it is unlikely for a "Possible Kerrigan Evolution" to die and be born again and the need to learn again what the queen have teched up through upper tiers....

the possibility for kerrigan to evolve is probably just her own personal skills... or possibly flight perhaps??
didnt blizzard include her during the trailer? with the legs and the burning eyes??

 

The Queen is a unit that has to be defended. In the campaigns, whenever anyone has access to any type of hero, not just Kerrigan, said hero has to survive until the end, ergo, has to be defended. I never said that her abilities had so be the same either. She can have her extremely psychic spells while still retaining the essentials, like building Colonies and Tumours, Deep Tunnel, etc.

Hive Queens/Huge Queens/Hive Matriarchs or whatever they're called now aren't disposable units. They're quite the opposite as they have to be defended at all costs otherwise you've got to start again from scratch. The same goes for Kerrigan being a Queen, only it's a bit more vital, so although Hive Matriarchs are physically disposable units, they're still not disposable. It's just like Tassadar and regular High Templars. If the High Templar dies, you've got to rebuild it, but if Tassadar, who is basically to High Templars as a Queen Kerrigan is to Queens, you've got to restart the mission.

Obviously Kerrigan won't just keep all her old abilities, spell for spell, so yes she can evolve in that way, but that does not prevent her from evolving physically. The trailer I was referring to was the actual announcement trailer which portrayed a much more gameplay based view of the game, not the cinematic trailer, which is mainly for show. I'm not disregarding the mottled, high-heeled foot and her the scaly head with burning eyes, but it is less gameplay based than the announcement trailer. Besides there could also be other explanations for them if they are in fact cinematics from the game. Just the head doesn't disprove my theory as none of her body is shown and the foot, though much less likely to be in the same category, could be a flashback of what's happened between BroodWar and StarCraft2, etc. They're more for the sake of cinematics anyway, unlike the announcement trailer which was based a lot more on the game/storyline.

 

well if thats how ugly u want kerrigan to be ill give u that =b but ill stick to my two queens since they work differently anyways

 

Who's to say that the humanoid Kerrigan will look better than a Queen Kerrigan? It would obviously be a different model, so wouldn't look exactly like the Queen, probably a cross between the Queen and the humanoid Kerrigan. Who's to say that the two Queens work in different ways? Kerrigan is a Queen, the Queen is a Queen. Queens are defensive but powerful units that manage the base. You can't really say that Kerrigan will work differently based on StarCraft1 anyway because look at the Queen back then. Huge difference. Why can't the same apply to Kerrigan?

What's the reason for you wanting a humanoid Kerrigan and regular Queen anyway? Is it just the visuals and the fact that Kerrigan didn't work that way in StarCraft1?

 

maybe you should start a poll on that? and lets see how people like theyre queens

 

If kerrigan is the queen it might have a negative effect on how balance/gameplay goes for the zerg campaign. Since in SC1 heroes worked because they were just a more powerful version of a unit you can mass (Raynor into vultures, marines and BC's) therefore you didn't have to use them much . But a unique unit which is the core of how the zerg are played becoming Something you cannot risk since its death means you lose would mean you are more restricted on how you play.

But then again this could be used on purpose in some missions to turn a normal base versus base mission into a far more cautious venture or depending on her strength a total offence

 

Kerrigan being the Queen would only have a negative effect on the campaign's gameplay if they designed the campaign's gameplay to fit the old Kerrigan and not the new one, which they obviously wouldn't. That's like saying that changing the Zerg's campaign would be negatively influenced by their new style of play, but the campaigns are obviously going to accomodate for that. They're not going to make the Zerg campaign only suit their old style of play, so why would they make the campaigns only suit the old Kerrigan?

Yes the Queen is the core unit of the Zerg, but that doesn't change anything. As you said, you didn't have to use the other heroes, like Raynor, much, basically meaning they'd be sitting around your base. That's what the Queen Kerrigan would be doing as well, only this time, she has a reason to be there. It's not as though she'd be easily killed or wouldn't function as a normal Queen properly. When attacking, you're seldom building more defences, so she wouldn't need to be back at your base. If she's in trouble, you can Deep Tunnel her back to your, or another, base. If you're attacking with her and realise that your opponent has a massive incoming attack force which your base would not be able to defend against, you can Deep Tunnel back and continue building defences, which is basically the same as what you'd do anyway, which would be to leave her and build defences with Drones, only this time you're bringing her back to defend as well.

 

Real Queens dont do the workers job, they let the lower class do the dirty job... Isnt the proble Kerrigans title as the queen of blades?? if so then why not let her be more higher than a queen perhaps the Goddess of "X" i find it hard not too see kerrigan in a campaign since shes still the zergs main hero and not queen who acts as a defensive strategist, who also has a chance of dying and aquiring temporary amnesia if you will ^_^... its really unlikely for a hero to die and lost their teched skills.... if in any chance that blizzard will finalize that the queen is kerrigan then i'll gladly accept the fact that i was entirely wrong.. but since we are still in the processing stage of the game, its not done until its done so we'll have to see,,,

 

If they did design the campaign along those lines Itza, SC might fall into the WC3 trap of creating the gameplay around a few central units instead of the whole picture( For example the campaign is nothing like multiplayer because you start off with a beefy or a few beefy heroes each map). While the SC campaign has always been good because you knew that your own personal strategy could be effective no matter what blizzard tried to throw at you with just a bit of tweeking.

Heroes are just fun things to throw into the fray if you feel you are gaining the upper hand.Therefore not nearly as useful as WC3 heroes. Same goes for the queen being the core unit of the zerg. It is just the whole defensive element of your strategy and if you beef it up to a level which would suit kerrigan lorewise you change the way the zerg is designed thus getting rid of the connection SC has between singleplayer and multiplayer strat wise.

If Kerrigan is just a unique unit who has a few powerful attacks but not something which could break up a whole army unless you want to risk losing the game it would be fine. Besides who wants to have Kerrigan stuck in your basecreating a few buildings and eating the ocasional marine when she could be out ambushing unexpecting expansions.

 

@ freedom23. I'm not saying that if Kerrigan dies, you need to retech her, and I'm not saying that Kerrigan should be like the final evolution of the Queen or anything, I'm just hypothesising that Kerrigan will be a heroic Queen, like how Tassadar was a heroic High Templar, Zeratul was a heroic Dark Templar and Raynor was a heroic *****. If she dies, you lose the mission, just like how if Tassadar dies, you'd lose the mission. Kerrigan wouldn't just be the Queen, she'd be a heroic Queen so her powers and differing abilities would allow her influence to spread beyond the borders of the Hive base.

@ marinefreak. Heroes, not WarCraftIII heroes but StarCraft heroes, existed in the StarCraft1 campaigns, so nothing has to change between StarCraft1 and StarCraft2. Queens, the StarCraft2 Queens already exist in more than just the campaigns, so other single-player and multi-player games as well, so nothing has to change their either. Kerrigan would be a heroic queen just as Tassadar was a heroic High Templar. Tassadar, a heroic High Templar, never pushed StarCraft1 into a WarCraftIII-type trap, so why would Kerrigan as a heroic Queen?

You've admitted that heroes are just things that stay behind until you've obviously won as you've also admitted with the Queen, so why would a unit designed to be like that, both a hero, which is kept back, and a Queen, which is also designed to be kept back, suddenly turn into an uber-unit that all the battles revolve around?

Who said that a Queen Kerrigan would have to be something that would break apart a whole army? That would obviously be overpowered, but why would she be that powerful in the first place? About her being stuck in your base creating defences, you've said yourself that heroes always tend to just stay back until you've obviously won because otherwise you're risking losing the whole mission, so why would it matter if Kerrigan is actually useful in that situation?

Both of you are acting as though this would be some kind of amazingly overpowered super-beast, but why? It's just a heroic Queen. Heroes can be used to complement an attack and the Queen Kerrigan would as well. The often just sit back in the base defending because otherwise they could be killed and therefore you'd lose the mission, so why does it matter if the Queen Kerrigan actually has a proper use when sitting at home? There are heroes and there are Queens, so it's not as though a heroic Queen would turn into a WarCraftIII hero or anything as they retain the roles of both a hero and their original unit.

 

Im not intending for Kerrigan to be an overpowered super beast, and im still not convinced of letting a modified heroic queen be the used as sprite for Kerrigan, Her evoliton phrase has been the real coz of these arguments, and i really do hope that they soon release the hero units custumized appearance as they promised in the recent Q&A thread....

I do want Kerrigan to be a kick-butt hero but in a sense that it should be in a controlled level, unlike WC3 heroes where certain ulti skills can drastically turn the tide against your enemies... in SC ussually, difficult campaigns tends to hinder our heroes from joining axn due to the danger factor and we also want to let them survive at all cost thats why players tend to make them stay at base... that complements your ideal Kerrigan coz shes somewhat suited for defenses.. but didnt Karune said that the heroes will get their own unique skills?? if so then that leaves your Heroic Queen Kerrigan (HQK) defenseless in terms of skills like the standard Hive Queen....

Tassadar is a high templar and high templars look the same.... But Kerrigan is unique, she's the only 1 which was corrupted through mutation and evolution... so that perhaps would conclude that theyll have to at least get another female ghost to make someone else a queen... now isnt that a bit hard to do for the zerg??

 

I do remember hearing something about unique abilities for heroes, but that won't bar them from using old ones. For example, heroic Ghosts will obviously be able to use Cloak, so Kerrigan will still be able to lay down defences if she needs to be able to be able to. She'll have other abilities as well anyway, probably more psychic ones than regular Queens, so she'll be less than defenceless.

It's irrelevant to bring up how Tassadar looked the same as High Templar, because they've told us that all heroes will look different to their unheroic counterpart. If Tassadar was in StarCraft2, which I'm sure he will in one way or another, he would not look like the regular High Templar. The reason Kerrigan looked different was because there was nothing for her to be the heroic counterpart of, but now there is. Infested Kerrigan wasn't the only unique model, as normal Kerrigan was also unique. The Zerg don't need another Terran Ghost to hatch into a heroic Queen either, as the Zerg are constantly evolving and seeing as she's the heart and soul of the Zerg, she's pretty much free to evolve how she wants, so to speak.

 

I'm not saying the kerrigan queen would be OP i'm saying that instead of being a diamond in the rough in a swarm of zerglings/hydralisks like she was in SC1. Kerrigan would be the backbone of your army (Blizzard has stated queens abilities also lend themselves to offence) because she'd just be a more powerful queen (A unique unit) which would make her too USEFUL. Which is a bad thing because...

1. It would require alot more focus on just the single unit which distracts you from micromanagment of your normal zerg units.

2.You would have to abandon your defence if there was a chance she'd die

3. It changes a major aspect of how the zerg works because it overcharges a unit whichis so specilised you could only get one anyway

4.It would also take out the whole evolving aspect behind the queen which from what we've read seems to be a major aspect of how the queen and indeed your whole defence keeps up to date with the power of other races. Obviously evolving Kerrigan every mission you had her would be silly.

5. First time zerg players wouldn't get as much of a feel for what the Zerg are like for multiplayer depending on the amount of missions which have kerrigan in them.

6. Kerrigans abilities would be taken up by the ability to build defences (I also don't want something like 8 abilities if you try to tell me they'd just add more).A "heroic" unique unit would add many abilities and none could be taken off since you couldn't have i "weaker" version of the unit with them.

And of course lorewise

1. Kerrigan was picked by the overmind for her psychic abilities which would allow her to control zerg forces (Not something the normal queen does since they have a habit of dieing xD)

2.I think Kerrigan would try to capatilize on her psychic abilities instead of learning how to build a few buildings and make creep poisonous (Why would she adapt herself to be like lesser minions?)

Point form to make it easier for you to quote =P

 

The Queen already is the backbone of the Zerg army, so that's not really changing anything at all. I don't recall hearing that the Queens abilities also lend themselves to offence, in fact I thought it was quite the opposite. Deploying Colonies is obviously defensive, Swarm Infestation obviously is as well, the same goes for Toxic Creep and Regeneration and Deep Tunnel returns her to your base immediately. I'm not saying that Kerrigan would or should be as offensive as the Queen's, but she'd definitely share a few of them with her Queen.

Not really. You said yourself that heroes usually just sit in your base, and seeing as no Zerg player will ever just constantly produce more and more static defence, once you've deployed it all, you can just leave her there which wouldn't be distracting at all. If your base is being attacked in which case she may be distracting like you said, if it's more worthwhile to micro Kerrigan, then micro Kerrigan. If it's not worth it, as you're unable to micro your normal units, why would you?

If your base is being so overrun that you have to flee her out of there, you've lost anyway. If it's not but she's still being attacked, you can Deep Tunnel to the back of your base or another base, whichever would be more worthwhile. Your base would not be defenceless, as your static defences would still be there. In StarCraft1 if you had to get all your Drones out for some reason, your base wouldn't be defenceless, as all your other units and Colonies would still be there.

The Zerg have already had their entire way they work changed, so something like this would hardly make a difference. Besides, it would not overcharge Kerrigan. You've said that heroes aren't usually in the midst of the action, so in that regard she's just like another Queen. In the Queen regard, you're not constantly building defences and managing your base, just like how in StarCraft1 you weren't constantly spewing out Drones to make more Colonies.

Saying that is just like saying that Tassadar takes out the whole upgrading thing behind regular High Templar which is a major aspect of you the High Templar and the rest of your army keeps up with the power of other races. If the Protoss didn't have High Templar in StarCraft1, they'd be at a major disadvantage, just like the Queen in StarCraft2. That didn't stop there being any heroic High Templar units in the campaigns, so why would it stop there being a heroic Queen in the StarCraft2 campaigns?

Besides, there are often unit restrictions on what you're able to produce in the campaigns, so instead of temporarily evolving the Queen Kerrigan, you permanently evolve her over the course of the campaign. It could be like how now you actually purchase the units that you want to use in the campaigns, like we saw in the campaign trailer, except you'd be evolving her instead of purchasing her.

That goes for almost all missions. Campaigns aren't designed to give first time players a feel for what the Zerg are like in multi-player. That's what single-player melees are for. If anyone wants a feel for multi-player, why would they play the campaigns, which are basically the polar opposite of multi-player games as far as StarCraft is concerned. In almost all campaigns you start with a base, start with units, there are events, you've got heroes, you've got missions, there are unit restrictions, etc, etc, etc, etc. Besides, it wouldn't be too different to if you had an extra normal Queen anyway. She'd still do everything the Queen can do, but she'd also be needed for requirements of certain missions.

Why couldn't any be taken off? As long as they're replaced and the physical unit is stronger, she'd still be a stronger version of the Queen. At the moment, the Queen has Burrow, Deep Tunnel, Regeneration, Swarm Infestation, Toxic Creep and Creep Tumors, Sunkens and Spore Colonies, which would probably share the same 'Build' spot, so that's six. Removing a couple of less needed things, like Poison Creep, Swarm Infestation, Regeneration and maybe even Build, to replace them with other things like Psionic Storm or other psionic or unique abilities would easily be enough to distinguish her. Besides, most heroes don't even added or differing abilities, so it wouldn't be shocking if only a couple of abilties were replaced with unique ones.

Queens actually do have the ability to control Zerg forces, like we see with her abilities such as Build and Swarm Infestation so it's a logical choice for Kerrigan to evolve into. Where did you get the supposed fact that Queens have a habit of dying from? They'd be the most protected unit in the Zerg Swarm, have the equal highest amount of health at full strength, as far as I'm aware they have the greatest attack as well, and they've also got the greatest number of abilities to help increase their survivability, notably Deep Tunnel which can instantly get them out of the fray.

How on Earth would she be a lesser minion?! As I said earlier, those are the abilities that could be replaced to make way for unique psychic abilities. Besides, she's so paranoid now that she'd probably want to be in complete control of absolutely everything which would explain why she'd be able to build Colonies, etc.

Cheers!

 

I doubt Kerrigan will play the role of the StarCraft II Zerg Queen. She has too many offensive combat abilities to make that work, and I don't think it fits the lore, either. She wants to lead the Zerg in an atack.

However, if Queens can have intelligence, there's nothing preventing you from having Kerrigan and a named, heroic Queen in the same mission. Any naming suggestions?

StarCraft II's Zerg campaign would be pretty boring if Kerrigan was the only Zerg hero. Without Cerebrates, we're basically left with:
1) A couple of Cerebrates she allowed to live. Downside: You can't use them as heroes (since they can't move).
2) Infested Terrans, like Ethan Stewart. (See Shadow Hunters.)
3) A Queen, or more than one, that has intelligence.
4) An Overseer, or more than one, that has intelligence.

 

As I said in my previous post, she doesn't have to have all the Queens abilities. Some of the less needed defensive abilities could easily be replaced with more offensive, psychic ones, enabling her to be more useful on the offence. marinesfreak also said earlier that Blizzard has said that Queens abilities also help with offence, so although it's unlikely, perhaps they are changing them up a bit.

In the StarCraft1 Zerg campaigns, Kerrigan was the only sentient Zerg hero. Through the first half of the normal campaigns they managed without her and there was also temporarily Duran in BroodWar, but that was it and Duran's gone now anyway. The Zerg focused on more powerful strains of units as heroes rather than sentient military leaders, which the other races had, so only having Kerrigan and a few enhanced strains would help differ their campaign from the others'.