JBL's Map Making Help Service

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JBL's Map Making Help Service​

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Intro​

I'm not scared to say that I'm a professional starcraft map maker because it's simply true.. it probably sounds pretencious.. but.. it's for your own good because I'm here to help you. I can help with Triggers, Briefings, Locations, Concepts, Units Placement, Balancing, Testing, Ideas, or simply ask me a question.

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How does it work​

First of all, I need informations about your map so I can help you.. If you request some help.. start by telling me these basic informations:

• 1 - What kind of help you need exactly.
  
• 2 - What the map is about (Defense, Offense, Bound, Micro, Melee, Madness, Turn Based Game, Puzzle, RPG, etc.. if you aren't sure, describe it a little..)
  
• 3 - Number of human AND computer players in the map. (this is important for the triggers)
  
• 4 - Your skill level in map making.. (So I know what kind of vocabulary to use and how details to give.)

That's about it.. If I feel like I need more information, I'll edit the post.

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Payment​

Yeah I'm doing this free.. but feel free to donate and/or  owerup:

 

We had one person already ask for help on a map. Good to see someone volunteering for this ^_^.
owerup:

I would help out as well but I rarely have the time + I have a lot of gaps in my knowledge about map making.

 

yeah.. time is the major flaw.. but.. with the years.. I can do pretty much any trigger job in 20 minutes.. and everything that is not about triggers takes about 1sec so..

 

Map making is something I'm looking forward to when SC2 is released I must say. Just seeing the new options makes me think happy thoughts ^_^

Maybe I'll have more time to do things when I finish school..

 

map making takes so much time.. i've waste so many hours to be fast like I am today..

btw I do all my triggers in pure text format...

Suppose I gotta do a trigger engine.. I do the inital trigger in semi text format in starforge.. then use Scmdraft2 to have it in txt.. and i copy paste in a .txt and thats how I do my triggers.. at the end all i have to do is copy paste it back in scmdraft2, save and open the map again in starforge.

 

Starforge trigger maker huh. I have to say I'm much too noob for that. I've always just used SCXE for my triggers because I don't have to remember the exact coding for each thing. Even then I don't know how to do certain things because of the fact that I don't know all the trigger functions. Never really used Scmdraft2 much.
I can see how you could do stuff fast the way you do it compared to SCXE's way.

 

I did start with SCXE.. I started slowly... it took a while to be fast with triggering...

I remember the last map I made with scxe.. it was a super big project.. some arena map with spells.. and I had to click so many times to duplicate every triggers.. u know.. you gotta copy every triggers made for P1 for the 5 other players...

it took me a few days.. lol

and now I would do it in about 20 minutes per player.. even if there are about 100+ triggers per player..

in the .txt you can do ctrl+f to find the values that you have to change.. so it's really fast

 

Yeah the duplication of triggers is a time waster for sure.

 

the hardest part is when your trigger engine (what I mean by trigger engine is.. sometimes what you want to do is so complex that you need like 20-30 triggers just to do one thing in the map.. it's called a trigger engine) has to be copied for every players with dozens of values that you gotta change.. like.. the locations, players, units, in both the conditions and actions..

that's why after a while, you learn to use less locations, less units, etc.. I could do a map with only 1 location.. many have done it before.. I didn't do it because it's easier to have like 5 to 10 locations...

most of the time I start with 5-10 and at the end.. I add some locations just to do the job quickly.. and to make sure it doesnt interfer with the 5-10 main locations that does everything...

 

What type of maps are those which you would use 5-10 locations on?
I find that even with the simplest of triggers and trigger engines (2 or 3 triggers associated with each other for instance) that I am prone to make a mistake somewhere even if it is VERY small it always mucks the whole thing up and takes a while to find.

 

I wish SEN was up.. I could show you a map I made with about 5 locations or so.. and it looks like a 1 000 locations map to some people..

with 1 location I could make ANY map.. anything can be made with only 1 location.. but it's dumb to only use one.. I always use at least 1 per player.. per trigger engine... If i truely finish a map with everything in it and all (I mostly do arena and turn based game maps) I will probably end up with 20 locations...

the key is.. the locations CAN MOVE!

you need death counters and switches..

death counters are so versatile.. they act like switches AND/OR timer.. so the possibilities are endless... the only thing a death counter can't do unless you do a whole new trigger is randomness.. but all you need a randomization trigger with switches.. then you make the actions to randomize some death counters.. and there you go

 

1 - What the map is about (Defense, Offense, Bound, Micro, Melee, Madness, Turn Based Game, Puzzle, etc.. if you aren't sure, describe it a little..)
It's sort of an infiltration map - players have to move through the station and eliminate opposition.

2 - Number of human AND computer players in the map. (this is important for the triggers)
Three human players, five computer players.

3 - What kind of help you need.
Right, I'm trying to import some sound onto the map - but when I try and use the sound importer in StarEdit it says "Make sure the folder is not read-only" or something. I've made sure the folder where my .WAV files are in isn't read only... but it still won't work. A little help?

4 - How much time you have to waste on a map... (is this just a quick 3-4 hours map.. a huge project?)
I'm probably going to spend quite a few hours on this, something to keep me occupied over the summer holidays.

~Pix~

 

Hey JBL, can you teach me about hyper triggers? I've had way too many bugs getting one fixed lol

 

1 - Hmm is that rpg-like.. hmm like you have 1 ghost and maybe a spellcasting system or something like this..? it's important that I know what you are making so I know how to think in order to help you.. I think it's some kind of rpg/team strategy with 1 unit per player right?

2 - Ok now I need to know if you REALLY need all these 5 computers ACTIVE in the map.. having all the slots used makes it hard to make a good map.. I'll explain why once I answer powerkickass's question..

3 - First of all I would start by using a real map editor.. Xtra editor 5 is a good choice.. try getting it @ www.staredit.net (i think the site is down right now.. or else i would give a direct link.. I might add a small section with links in the initial post..) This is some kind of problem that is probably more computer related than map making related.. I've never seen this before.

Try putting your files in another folder... but I'm pretty sure Xtra Editor will fix ur problem.

 

What? what is a hyper trigger? lol?? I don't know what it is..

LOL .. I'm just kidding..

Hmm what you should do is.. delete your hyper triggers and do exactly what I'll tell you..

First of all.. you need a computer player.. that is in the game.. but that you won't use.. that means.. a computer player with a start location.. no other units, no other triggers.. no other use at all... that's where you'll place your hypers.. The reason we need this computer player is because the hyper triggers WILL mess with every other triggers under the same player/force.

So you probably know how to do a hyper.. but i'll just explain it here. (I use the starforge way for the triggers)

Condition:​

Always();

Actions:​

Comment("hypers");
PreserveTrigger();
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
Wait(0);
... (in fact, you want 62x Wait(0); because the maximum number of actions is 64)

once this is done, copy your hyper trigger 2 more times.. so you have 3 hypers.. this is more than enough.. in fact I think 2 would be ok.. but I always made 3..

I'm pretty sure you had problems with your hypers because they were in a used computer slot..

Ohhh.. one more thing.. most of the bugs in a map are due to the use of wait triggers.. I remember when I started.. that was really a major problem.. it always messed up my maps.. you shouldn't use the wait action at all unless you know exactly what you are doing..

To create a "wait" without using the action.. here's what you can do..

I'll do a simple trigger using a "wait".. and then.. the way to do it without using any "waits"

Condition:​

Always

Actions:​

Wait X
Create a marine at Location X for Player X
Preserver Trigger
Comment


ok now here is the way to do it without a wait... you need 2 triggers.. they can be in separate players.. it might look weird.. but trust me.. it's uber 1337

Condition:​

Death count for Academy for Player Y is exactly Y

Actions:​

Create a marine a location X for Player X
Set Deaths for Academy for Player Y to ZERO
Preserve Trigger
Comment

//////////////////////////////
2nd trigger:
/////////////////////////////​

Condition:​

Always

Actions:​

Add 1 Death of Academy to Player Y
Preserve Trigger
Comment




Ok.. I used Academy because it's one of the first (probably the first) unit alphabeticaly.. and in starforge.. it's just easier.. but you HAVE TO PICK A UNUSED UNIT IN UR MAP.. don't worry there are so many.. in extended map editors.. there are units that make the map crash.. you can even use these as death counters.. any unit will work.. it's a just a way to keep track of the triggers..

and how is this a wait?

everything the 2nd trigger runs.. it adds 1 death to academy... and it runs like once every x milliseconds (sry I don't remember.. I used to be sooooo leet I would tell you exactly but.. I can't remember.. I know the information is on Staredit.net.. anyway.. just test to know how many deaths you want it to wait..

so.. once it reachs X deaths.. (lets say.. 30) the trigger will laugh.. and it will reset the 2nd trigger by setting it to ZERO death...

try it.. you'll see.. that's how all the pros do their wait triggers.

 

owerup: well earned
scoreboard counter > spider mine counter

 

so.. it did fix your map??

when you use death counters all the time.. you'll see.. your map won't bug anymore.. the only bugs what will happen are those like.. you accidently put location X instead of Y in a trigger.. and as soon as you test the map you realise what you did and you go fix it.. no more frustrating: "WTF IS THAT?"

 

Nope, I still haven't touched it for ages =P
But I can trust your expertise lol. Your advice was very logically anyhow.
The map that's infected with a few timing bugs (which doesn't really affect gameplay anyways. most major bugs had already been fixed) has no leftover slots, and I just can't be bothered finishing it =/
I'll definitely put your idea in practise if I ever continue making a few more maps. Atm I've started and kinda hoping to complete a series of 'racecraft' maps. A type of competitive racing map with a vulturebike which includes ideas like actual obstacle boundaries that would damage/destroy your bike in contact, multi-courses, SFX obstacles, special item inventory (like mario kart battle), skill systems, upgrades etc, but I bet, like with all my other ideas, I'd probably wouldn't finish either. Maybe I should learn your way of making, with starforge (it really OMFGs my computer >.<)

If you want I could send you my work in progress, and do you still have any of your creations? I always like trying people's new maps =P

 

Bunker Wars can't get as popular as dota.. because dota has a super duper replay value.. there are so many heroes and items.. and the way the pvp is made makes it the best use map setting map ever.. forget about a madness map being as popular.. most of the time.. madness are played by noobs.. and I'll probably not make maps for Starcraft 2.. I don't make maps for Warcraft 3 and the way the maps are going to be programed is probably going to be the same.. i'm sure this is THE reason why Starcraft 1 will be played after starcraft 2 is released..

 

I've lost many of my maps.. and most of them were mostly experimental and doesn't worth playing.. However my best map is hosted on www.staredit.net.. browse for Reflector 2

its for 2-4 players.. If someone is interested I could host it sometimes... but.. I'm very busy these days.. I just moved and I got a lot of stuff to do...