Influence of Nydus Worm and baneling on zerglings for mid and late game

since theres not much yet to discuss about zerg ill start some speculation about how the worm and the new mutation will have an impact on using zerglings :thumbup:

i found zerglings in sc1 quite obsolete after 15 mins of playing..
they got killed by everything and i couldnt even send them to enemies expansions since theyld probably die by some enemy scouts on the way lol

the baneling mutation no doubt makes them even useful after the start period of a game whenever u need ground suicide.. (though this mutation will probably cost vespin and needs an upgrade)

after all ild say the nydus worm will have huge influence on using zerglings more frequently during the whole game!
in the official video 1 worm pops 16 zerglings (you can count that)
in sc1 terms that would be 8 hydras or 4 ultras just twice as much as an overlord can transport... :

while the overlords fly around killable the worms dont seem to be attackable till they pop out of the ground...
as well the worms seem to be one way units..
they look quite dead after they popped out of the ground waiting for the protoss units and get killed...ild think you can only use a worm once .. transport and than have to build a new one if needed...
anyways i hope the nydus canal will not be replaced by the worms since its function of connecting your bases doesnt seem to be given through the worms...

actually what i want to say is it looks like you can bring now your cheap zerglings protected (invisible in worm)
to whatever the worms range conditions will be ..thinking of being able to pop a bunch of zerglings at least close to an enemy expansion.
while your main base is in mid or end tech level youll probably concentrate on mutas, hydras and theyr mutations trying to win some ground... now it seems you can just pop a bunch of zerglings (for minerals only) transport them in a worm and have a cheap possibility to disturb enemy expansion without having to send a "greater army" .. zerglings are quite deadly to any unprotected base + drones and 16 (full worm xD) will even be able to destroy some basic defenses like 1-2 canons or bunker...
(of course not when theres already 10tanks and 2 battlecruisers in an expansion but mostly theyre quite unprotected for a long time since the real battle is somewhere else and zerg have best scout options no doubt)

 

Re: influence of nydusworm+baneling on zerglings for mid+ games

I remember having 200 pop of cracklings and dropping them all into the base of the enemy. Maybe not very versatile, but fun as hell.

And I'm being surprised by you guys, we know like 4 zerg units and you're already starting to come up with interesting theories. Even though we doesn't know quite how they'll work, nydus worm+banelings sounds sweet as hell. ^_^

 

Re: influence of nydusworm+baneling on zerglings for mid+ games

Ya but what my real question is, is how the hell do the nydus worms work, I mean if they can sprout up just about anywhere in the map that can pose serious problems for all races including the zerg. I'll have to see some limiting factors b4 I can state any stategies.

 

Re: influence of nydusworm+baneling on zerglings for mid+ games

Wow, how frightening would it be to see a Nydus worm pop up right on top of your huge army and spit out a whole bunch of banelings... that'd just suck. I think Nydus worms are going to be one of the coolest additions to starcraft 2, I really can't wait to see exactly how they work.

 

Re: influence of nydusworm+baneling on zerglings for mid+ games

I bet the nydus worms can unburrow to load up troops. Then the only way for them to move is to burrow. Also if they are killed while underground maybe the units inside them can become burrowed rather than just die

 

Re: influence of nydusworm+baneling on zerglings for mid+ games

oh wow that is dirty. thats like in cnc zero hour where people pop those gla suicide bikes in tunnels

 

This could give zerg an even bigger advantage in making new bases. All a zerg player has to do is load 8 drones, 2 ultras, and 8 hydras into 2 nydus worms and can essentially set up a well defended base anywhere on the map...
On the issue of banelings, i think they'll cost 25 mins/gas to convert and do the same as scourages. If you pop one of those in an unexplorered area of your opponents base, gg for them. Even 1 baneling could be devestating cause it's as powerful as a scarab when it rolls into enemies mineral line.

 

very nice idea about they just stay burrowed rather than die. i'd like that very much but i'm afraid they'd think it'd be too rigged

 

Those are some nice strategies. I really can't wait to how the Nydus Worm really works. Will they be able to pop out anywhere? Or is there a range restrictment. So many questions about this Nydus Worm. Hopefully, we get to learn about them during BlizzConn.

 

Well, I'm positive Blizzard is working really hard on Nydus Worms right now. Underground units have always been a sort of a problem in RTS's. How do we show them move, how do they attack, etc. Anyone remember underground transport thing from Red Alert? I'm guessing they'll make the Nydus Worms similar to those, load up, go under, pop up, unload...

It's also possible that Blizzard might get rid of Worms entirely -_-

 

2 ultras? I'm sure you want to use ur worms before you upgrade your tech up to the ultralisks.

about the banelings.. it's a good theory.. the cost sounds fair.

 

I think that this would be unfair in terms of a transport unit because of the fact that all other transports upon destruction destroy all units within them as well. The idea that it'd be possible to destroy a transport unit without destroying the units within gives an unfair advantage.

Also with the worms there definitely has to be a limit to the space they're able to travel. Odds are it will have to be somewhere that has already been scouted.

With the banelings i thought what would be a good strategy would be to have them hidden somewhere outside of your base since from the video we can see they move fairly quickly (or if your enemy doesn't use detectors have them burrowed and unleash them after the enemy walks past). During an enemy assault of your base, you can bring out the banelings from behind and destroy whatever serious damage dealers they have in the back of their assault while your main forces deal with the damage absorbers at the front lines.
Edit: This is with the thought that the banelings don't have a set life span. They seem to deal sufficient damage when they blow up so it's quite possible that they have a set life span and will die after a certain amount of time.

 

I wonder how the terain will effect Nydus movement. Think it can go underwater and some such? Space would also be a problem...

Maybe it even functions like a canal that's portable (fast travel from a to b). In other words, one end is at your base, the other is the worm. If the worm dies, units in transit die. But unlike the canal, the worm can move. After all, it looks latched on to the ground by bone.

It's hard to form a good idea without seeing it in action...

 

In the video gameplay demo you can see that after the worm releases 16 zerling it remains stationary and doesn't move thereafter just sitting there while protoss units attack it. So odds are the worms are a one time use type of deal for unit transport. If this is true then the question arises if overlords will still be utilized as unit carriers and if yes then which will be cheaper, having a bunch of worms or skipping worms and just using overlords. The worms however would be alot more useful for stealthy transport since they dont seem to be detectable underground (there was no use of detectors in the video so we could not define whether they would be detectable underground.

 

My own personal wild theory is the Worms are Canal variants. They aren't "Transport" type units, that can be moved such as Overlords, but more like Canals that don't require Creep.

 

If this is true then I'm questioning the use of 3 Nydus worms in the preview demo that was sent out. If it was similar to a canal then the use of 3 would be pointless unless they all originated from different bases. Also the idea of it being a transport is likely because all 3 spit out 16 zerling giving the idea that the max unit transport for a nydus worm is 16 zerling...8 hyras...etc. etc.

 

I bet the new terran radar can pick it up. It would be up to the player to react. The protoss can probably one hit the worm when it comes out anyway with a dark templar, but who knows.

 

I doubt that, the worms will probably have a decent amount of health. If they're the Zergs big new toy this time around, they're not going to be that easy to counter.
If they do end up to be a Canal variant, a fun thing to do would be to send a couple of lurkers through and plant them around the worm so when an unsuspecting opponent goes to kill it with his marine army they just get torn apart, and then get a huge zergling swarm coming at them right after! Good fun ;D